Federation Star Ships

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:32 am

And as we're talking about kits: What about a Cobra-3-with-a-silly-saucer-section.oxp? (As the very late but definitive entry to the PIMP MY COBRA competition.)

Selezen · Post by **Selezen** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:46 am

Commander McLane wrote:
I agree that this is the only halfway sensible explanation for their existence (although it doesn't explain why no imagined ships from previous periods are available as kits; like anything from Jules Verne or so).

No-one's got round to doing it yet. Or maybe they're all sitting in garages somewhere...

Commander McLane wrote:
However, I still can't imagine a Cobra III-to-Constitution-Kit. That wouldn't be like VW Polo-to-Lamborghini, but more like Cessna-to-A380.

I only have the spark of an idea - I'll let you put the meat on the bones. Hey, this is the most I've posted in weeks!

Maybe the Anaconda would be a more apt base ship... Either that or scratch build it and use the power plant from the Cobra in the engineering hull.

Jagen Ordo · Post by **Jagen Ordo** » Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:28 pm

Well, we could do a Cobra-to-Orion kit, though.
Still have a model of that, but it might be a bit too polygon-heavy.
Should be able to adapt ig, if there's interest.

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:00 am

Jagen Ordo wrote:
Well, we could do a Cobra-to-Orion kit, though.

For obvious reasons (see my Avatar) I would be very interested in that.

Jagen Ordo · Post by **Jagen Ordo** » Fri Aug 14, 2009 1:09 pm

Knew that.
Next time I get around it, I'll try and make my Orion model Oolite compatible.

Jagen Ordo · Post by **Jagen Ordo** » Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:10 pm

Orion project, almost there. Will use the script and stuff from my old release.
At least I think I released it. The Federation will have to wait a bit, I couldn't script if my life depended on it.
Could somebody helpd me scripting, please?
I find myself reminded; McLane, if you want to take a look at my Orion, go to colonel-azzameen.deviantart.com and visit my gallery. I have enough pics there.

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:12 am

I would be more than happy to help you with the scripting. Just PM me what you need.

Jagen Ordo · Post by **Jagen Ordo** » Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:24 pm

Will do, next week. I should have planned something until then.

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 7:27 am

I became aware over the weekend that I have to add one issue to the "kit"-explanation:

Selezen wrote:
I always class these as ships that inhabitants of the Ooniverse have designed or created as "kits" for existing ships. Much in the same way that we currently build Lambourghinis out of old VW Polos, the same market would apply for building an Enterprise out of a Cobra Mk III.

Scratch built kit ships. Fan boys who have heard of Star Trek and Star Wars as ancient entertainment ships from the legendary 20th century "telly-vision" concept. Put them together and you have a completely justified reason for trek and SW ships to exist in Oolite. Maybe some factory somewhere is churning them out.
Me wrote:
I agree that this is the only halfway sensible explanation for their existence...

...but it is only valid for traders, not for other classes of ships. In other words:

(1) Yes, I can imagine that the fanbois would remodel their Cobra, or Fer-de-Lance, or whatever into a Star Wars/Star Trek/Babylon 5/Space Patrol/whatever-ship through an expensive "kit", as long as the end result stays roughly with the size of the Cobra/Ferdy that was the base in the first place. That means a "no" to a Constitution (or any other ship of this type) in its "original" size. At the very least the whole thing would be able to dock (I can't imagine a fan boy buying a ship which he can't show off in front of his friends in the docking bay). And this limits its size pretty much to the width of a Cobra III. (This was my argument in my first reply. What I'm adding now is the following argument:)

(2) Police and military (as institutions; I am not speaking of individual members here) are usually not fan boys, and they usually do not remodel their vessels to make them look like ancient fictional vessels (I never have met a police or military vessel of any kind in RealLife™ that looked like a drawing by Leonardo da Vinci or something of the like; so I think it is safe to say that I wouldn't expect anything like that in the 32nd century as well). Which means a "no" to a Constitution (or any other ship of this type) as a police or military ship.

(3) Therefore the only way I can imagine an "original size" Constitution (or any other ship of this type) appearing in the Ooniverse would by as a tell-tale not unlike that of the Flying Dutchman. You would have the very minute chance to watch an epic battle between a "Federation" and a "Klingon" ship (or ships) in the distance, outside the space lanes once or twice during your whole career, and would never be sure if you just had a hallucination. Ideally you wouldn't be able to interfere with the action, just watch.

Right now I can't think of another convincing justification for the existence of 20th century fictional spaceships in a 32nd century Ooniverse. Which doesn't mean that I'm denying anybody the right to model these ships and put them in OXPs. I'm not in a position to do that. It just means that I myself wouldn't install these OXPs. Perhaps once, to have a look at the cool model, but not for my gameplay.

Selezen · Post by **Selezen** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 7:59 am

I agree, they are not gameplay mods, more the sort of fun sideline that people will install and go "heh, that's pretty cool" before uninstalling it and getting back to the serious business of thargoid baiting.

I still think that someone somewhere would make a constitution-class model, just for the fun of it - I know two separate people who have made full-size daleks and TARDIS models (exterior AND interior) only to sell them on or take them to displays.

Here's a thought - in one system there could be a sci-fi technology museum, and in that orbital museum there are models of many popular fictional spaceships. Just so that people can come and marvel at the outlandish ideas some early humans had about how space travel would work.

The existing code from the TOGY could be used and the models replaced with the SF models. Any size any shape - no docking worries for the models and no need to write an AI or an engine routine since they are only static models. They will only be seen in one place (the museum) and the player has to specifically travel there to see them!

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:29 am

Selezen wrote:
Here's a thought - in one system there could be a sci-fi technology museum, and in that orbital museum there are models of many popular fictional spaceships. Just so that people can come and marvel at the outlandish ideas some early humans had about how space travel would work.

The existing code from the TOGY could be used and the models replaced with the SF models. Any size any shape - no docking worries for the models and no need to write an AI or an engine routine since they are only static models. They will only be seen in one place (the museum) and the player has to specifically travel there to see them!

Now that's a cool idea. Give that man a cookie!

Yes, a museum. And of course in this case all ships could and would have their original size.

I can see it before me, in Diriledi (Gal 8 ): "THE MUSEUM AT THE END OF THE OONIVERSE!". A must-go for every commander.

"IF YOU HAVE SEEN EVERYTHING ELSE, COME TO SEE OUR ASTONISHING COLLECTION OF HUMAN OUTLANDISHNESS!" (Diriledi is inhabited by Black Slimy Frogs!)

(Although it would probably need a more high-tech world.)

Jagen Ordo · Post by **Jagen Ordo** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:41 am

Speaking of docking issues, I once tried to auto-dock on this bounty-hunter space bar (or whatever it was), and feared I'd blow.
Granted, front shields went down, but that's about it.
More serious were the clipping issues. I could see the inside of the station...

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 12:27 pm

Yes, there are rare instances where you fly halfway through it before the docking mechanism kicks in (at least it used to be so). Has to do with the model.

Jagen Ordo · Post by **Jagen Ordo** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 12:53 pm

Hm, that makes it a bit difficult with the Orion. She's fairly big, you know.
Calculating from the size difference seen in the landing bay scene, she's about a hundred metres in diameter. Just don't know if that was with or without the weapon needles.

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:15 pm

Jagen Ordo wrote:
Hm, that makes it a bit difficult with the Orion. She's fairly big, you know.
Calculating from the size difference seen in the landing bay scene, she's about a hundred metres in diameter.

Which is actually not very big. The Enterprise is what? 700 meters long?

A Cobra III is 65 x 130 x 30 meters (L x W x H). A docking bay is 250 x 192 x 64 (Depth x W x H). So the Orion would be a nice case in point of my argument. Could be a Cobbie-based kit, and would not significantly exceed the dimensions of a Cobbie. If you imagine two Cobra III mounted back on back, you already have a roughly round shape with a diameter of 130 meters. The rest is bodywork.

Probably the Orion should be a little bigger than that.

The docking limit would be the 192 meter width of the docking bay, minus something sensible, so you don't scratch your hull every time you dock. A Thargoid is 180 meters in diameter, and therefore would just fit.