Is it me....

[pievets]

Or is the combat a lot harder in oolite than it used to be on the bbc(and for that matter New kind).

I can't kill anything!

[Murgh]

I thought it was super hard when I began on the c64

technique is certain to improve with practice and experience, and it's bound to help.

[Wiggy]

I've just restarted the game from scratch. It does seem a mite harder even than earlier versions of Oolite!

But then, that may just be because I've got used to being hard as nails.
I've got BBC Elite on an emulator, so may do some parallel piloting for comparison.

Having lobbied Giles hard to implement loss of cargo and damage when getting shot at, I'm now wishing I hadn't, as I lose about 10t of every load to pirate fire. But they will rue the day....

[Cmdr. Wombat]

Or is the combat a lot harder in oolite than it used to be on the bbc(and for that matter New kind).

I can't kill anything!

Early on you're best off just trading and avoiding fights. Save up your credits until you can upgrade your laser, get an ECM system and witchspace fuel injectors (buy these first). Then maybe you'll find combat isn't quite so hard. Then you'll need fuel scoops so you can collect your hard won spoils.

[lex_talionis]

combat - i used to find it impossible. i remember about 4 months ago, being pleased as anything when i got my first kill.

i'm at over 1000 now, and, short of anything that involves either a) rattle cutters b) weeviloid hunters or c) more than one wolf mark II, i'll take on anything. and usually win - but not always haha.

trust me, it gets easier. it's hard at first, esp. while getting used to the controls etc, and learning where and when to push buttons to take you to the desired place but *shrug* it's worth the effort!

[Rxke]

I remember my first succesful fight, dead at night somewhere, a non-decked out Cobra (read: pulse lasers)

It was -I kid you not- twenty minutes of sheer adrenalin-pumping terror, always hitting the opponent *almost* killing him, but then losing sight, getting almost shot to bits myself etc...

Eventually I got him. One kill. I sat back and knew I was hooked. Badly.

'twas Oolite 1.2x, and since then the AI has improved immensely, so I guess it's even harder now...

But thats (E)Oolite: start humble and innocent, do boring, bad-paying commerce-runs between safe planets, try to stay out of harm's way, slooooowly building up capital (hint: fuelscoops are a good early investment: if you encounter asteroids, shoot them to bits, good practice, and they don't shoot back, heh. If you're lucky, they blow up in shards, extra free profit...)

I recently lost my savefile, so I had to start all over again, but felt like It was beneath my status to do the milkruns, so I rightaway swapped in my CobraMkIII to a MkI, and decked it out with offensive and defensive goodies, so I could get into fights from day one.
(And discovered why the MkI's are so cheap, but that's another story)

[hoqllnq]

combat in classic elite was way easier.

anything beond a certain distance/size would become a 3x2
pixel block, a way too large surface to hit from long distance.

pirates would appear 3 or 4 very close together. you could
beam 3 (or all 4) of them before your laser would heat up or
even before they fired their first shot.

also, i think in the original the other ships were way weaker
than your cobra. in oolite this difference seems smaller if
existent at all. and i dont think other ships would recover over
time.


on the other hand: combat in oolite is easier to avoid.

in elite youd have a given chance (depending on your status
and the systems stability) of running into other ships, on
every micro-jump, no matter where you jump. in oolite ships
are still there when you can't see them and there arent many
outside the path from the witchspace beacon to the planet
(or the station), so flying outside this path will usually
avoid any encounters.

[Dilbert]

...anything beond a certain distance/size would become a 3x2
pixel block, a way too large surface to hit from long distance....

Ah yes! I can remember zapping the baddies from ten klicks or more with ease. It got too easy after a while.

Just keep practicing, pievets. Rxke 's suggestion's a great idea. (I just wish I'd thought of it when I started out!) I've only been playing a month or so and am over 1,000 kills already. In my last scrap I took on a fleet of eight GalCops. But I'm not there yet cos two of 'em got away.

[TGHC]

I agree completely with hoqllnq a very good summation.

I also agree with Rxxe about the adrenilin pumping of combat that is one of the big highs.

However......Oolite combat is harder.

I used to be able to force witchspace and take out 4 or 5 Thargoids, but even dealing with one now is tricky. Similarly if 4 or 5 iron ass pirates jump you are toast, it should be possible to make more of a fight of it , taking out one or two is all I seem to manage now. I'm having to use the energy bomb occasionaly now Also have not been able to take missiles out yet with the laser which you could before (as did young Ryder in The Dark Wheel).


The biggest difference seems to be that the military laser heats up much quicker which is very frustrating, and either the enemy has better shielding or the ML does not pack as big a punch as before. We already have shield boosters etc so perhaps a turbo cooler on the ML available after a suitable number of kills (eg when deadly) could be an option to consider.

As I've always said before you have to earn your spurs, I've been playing for about 10 days now and have 330ish kills, currently on the constrictor mission. I've seen that there is a military energy unit from the Thargoid mission so that will be my next piece of kit, but it would be nice to have a stronger ML.

Becoming Elite in Oolite is a major major challenge as it is now it seems an awful long way off.

(but then perhaps that's how it should be )

[winston]

The enemies are indeed stronger. In classic Elite, if you met a Cobra Mk.3, it was significantly weaker than your own Cobra Mk.3 (just a few hits would kill it, whereas an enemy would have to do a lot of lasing to even get into your energy banks).

By contrast, in Oolite, an enemy Cobra Mk.3 is just as strong as your own.

[TGHC]

A useful weapons upgrade would be a Military laser target lock as used in Xelite.

What it does is change the laser "cross hairs" from green to red when the target is capable of being hit with the laser, if the target moves out of the cross hairs, it returns back to green. Particularly useful when the target is a long distance away and also helps to conserve laser temperature a little in a dog fight.

In Xelite it comes with the Miltary laser, but I think it would be better in Oolite as an enhancement. A small but very expensive add on that gives a marginal increase in your combat capabilities.

[neilplus]

Also have not been able to take missiles out yet with the laser which you could before (as did young Ryder in The Dark Wheel).

It can be done. I was running away from an ECM-hardened missile the other day, and whilst waiting for it to run out of fuel, I decided to try the (rear-mounted) mining laser on it. Imagine my surprise when I hit it - I couldn't even see it - at the first shot. Missiles must settle into the exactly rearward spot while they're chasing you...

[Flying_Circus]

Missiles must settle into the exactly rearward spot while they're chasing you...

Not usually. The way their AI checks for a path of intercept means they usually end up performing a steadily-diminishing spiral course towards their targets as they persue them.

Good illustration of fractal maths using simple repetitive, iterative rules to produce patterned behaviour, actually .

[JensAyton]

Not usually. The way their AI checks for a path of intercept means they usually end up performing a steadily-diminishing spiral course towards their targets as they persue them.

Good illustration of fractal maths using simple repetitive, iterative rules to produce patterned behaviour, actually :).

But not a good demonstration of optimal intercept behaviour. ;-)

[Dilbert]

I agree the ML heats up too quickly. And it's difficult to fire off a single "positioning" shot. Maybe I'm lead-fingered but I always seem to fire off a burst, which just adds to the heating-up problem.

Similarly if 4 or 5 iron ass pirates jump you are toast, it should be possible to make more of a fight of it , taking out one or two is all I seem to manage now.

I'm trying a new way of handling pirate fleets after getting badly hammered several times in succession: close engagement. I noticed they'll blast you heavily from a distance but ease up if you're amongst 'em (probably for fear of shooting each other). So now I fuel-inject right into their midst as soon as they appear on the scanner.

I've done it three times now and walked away from each battle. Might be worth trying...