Commander, that thing is back on the scanner ...

[caracal]

My ship is shedding parts, venting plasma and atmosphere, running at a quarter speed, but inside a sentient organism yet lives. Hard for me to believe that I haven't posted here since July of 2008. Had a noisy but brief one-month run on this forum that summer, going from a clueless Jameson to a still-clueless but swaggering journeyman, arguing game balance and coding my own OXPs. Then some very bad RL things took over and I dropped off, but now I'm back, and I hope for longer this time. Unless you guys run me off at laserpoint!

I see a lot of familiar faces still posting, and many new ones. The game has also progressed in some interesting and delightful ways. Great to see the program and its community so active and thriving! Makes me glad I thought to give it a look last week. You guys have something amazing going on here, but you know that by now.

Back when I left, the whole brouhaha with Lestradae and Realistic Shipyards was simmering but hadn't really begun to boil over yet. I see that it did during my absence, and I'm glad I missed it. I'm seeing bits of debris from it scattered all over the forum. I don't want to re-open old wounds, so I'll just say that I'm sorry it turned acrimonious at any point, and I hope it's all sorted and healed by now. Yes, I know there was a fork, which isn't exactly "healing"; I just meant, I hope everybody is back to being happy now, or at least as happy as they were before it erupted.

Also back then the 1.7x series of oolite was making its debut, and now I'm using 1.73.4 and loving it. The user-visible changes are for the most part subtle, but a lot more stuff seems to "just work" now, instead of being a new experimental shaky feature, and I'm really glad to see that and applaud the efforts of the developers. Overall things just seem to be a lot more solid.

I see a lot of new OXPs, and some old ones that have gone by the wayside. I think I get the biggest chuckle from my new Planetary Info equipment, which often pops up the message "No major pirate activity" just as a series of flashes from exploding ships decorate the background. I assume its messages are useful for telling hunters whether to spend time looking for lots of lane pirates or not, and am just about to the point with my latest commander to start finding that out.

Ramirez, I see you took the idea for Feudals and ran with it, which is great. So far I haven't participated in any of its activities, mostly because I haven't spent much time seeking them out. I did find and dock with a Royal Hunting Lodge once (love the modelling and texturing!) but it was otherwise just another OXP station. Maybe my commander wasn't worthy at the time.

Now for the questions. You knew they were coming, didn't you?

First, I notice the Fuel Station OXP saying that in 1.73.4 it shows up on your space compass as a "fuel pump icon", yet I still see an "F". I saw a thread that suggested that yes it does, no it doesn't, so was wondering what the real story is. I eventually uninstalled the OXP because I couldn't tell the factories from the fuel stations, and at the time I really wanted to find the factories more.

Next, back when the constores were "just boxes", they seldom rotated, at least in my experience. Now, they're these gorgeous neon-encrusted salt shakers (they're fantastic, by the way, just a total visual delight), and every single one I've encountered was spinning just like a coriolis. But, um ... they have no nav buoy. Is that just part of the fun, lining up on them with no buoy? I guess part of my problem is that my el cheapo graphics setup gets juddery when the docking port fills the screen, so I'm prone to lose my normally acceptable piloting skills and make a mess in the parking lot, so to speak. Still, I'd have thought that a "convenience store" would be a bit more, um, convenient.

The mil-spec HUD is even better than before, and I loved it then. When I buy a new ship that comes with its own HUD, I quickly store that sucker in the closet and go back to my beloved sniper dot. But is there a way to turn off the target reticle when you're inside a station? Or preferably, any time you're not seeing an external view. Probably not, but I figured I'd ask.

Also, I recall 1.71 and 1.72 using a relatively minor amount of CPU time when running. Now, though, 1.73.4 uses about 50% continuously, which still doesn't have any visible effect on the rest of my system, but it does wake up my CPU cooling fan to start its roaring. This is on Linux, so I don't expect a lot of ready answers, especially since I've provided almost no details, but I thought I'd ask if anybody else has seen this behavior, on any system. I have a couple other Linux-specific questions, but I'll reserve those for that forum.

I have another question related to uber ships and OXPs and cheating and philosophy and suchlike, but it doesn't seem to fit here, so I'll post it later.

Anyway, it's good to be back, and great to see that you guys are still actively chatting, trading, riding to the rescue, murdering, stealing, setting things on fire, and doing all the other wonderful stuff that make the Ooniverse such an interesting place. Keep it up!

[JazHaz]

Next, back when the constores were "just boxes", they seldom rotated, at least in my experience. Now, they're these gorgeous neon-encrusted salt shakers (they're fantastic, by the way, just a total visual delight), and every single one I've encountered was spinning just like a coriolis. But, um ... they have no nav buoy.

No they don't, but they do appear on the advanced compass as 'C'. When you go to them from the witchpoint (in the latest version) they are always oriented 90° to the witchpoint. So all you need to do is to rotate so that the station is horizontal, and aim for the end with the docking port. Usually you can approach dead on the right line, and just have to stop at the right place (I watch out the side view).

Also, I recall 1.71 and 1.72 using a relatively minor amount of CPU time when running. Now, though, 1.73.4 uses about 50% continuously, which still doesn't have any visible effect on the rest of my system, but it does wake up my CPU cooling fan to start its roaring.

This is probably due to the extra work that shaders require.

But anyway, nice to see an old hand back!

[CptnEcho]

Welcome back.

[Rxke]

Hey caracal, good to see you back!

(No, my sig has been like that since ages )

[Zieman]

Also, I recall 1.71 and 1.72 using a relatively minor amount of CPU time when running. Now, though, 1.73.4 uses about 50% continuously, which still doesn't have any visible effect on the rest of my system, but it does wake up my CPU cooling fan to start its roaring.

This is probably due to the extra work that shaders require.

Shouldn't shaders be the GPU's problem? No need for the CPU to crank up cycles...
I run a WinXP system myself, and get similar CPU load with 1.73.4 - should I ?

[JazHaz]

Also, I recall 1.71 and 1.72 using a relatively minor amount of CPU time when running. Now, though, 1.73.4 uses about 50% continuously, which still doesn't have any visible effect on the rest of my system, but it does wake up my CPU cooling fan to start its roaring.

This is probably due to the extra work that shaders require.

Shouldn't shaders be the GPU's problem? No need for the CPU to crank up cycles...
I run a WinXP system myself, and get similar CPU load with 1.73.4 - should I ?

Dunno, you might be right. Don't have a proper GPU myself!

It could be something like having bigger and more complicated ships in a system thats increasing CPU load? Slowdowns are often caused by too many objects.

[Smivs]

It could be something like having bigger and more complicated ships in a system thats increasing CPU load? Slowdowns are often caused by too many objects.

I've found this, too, particularly recently testing the HD (2048x2048px textures) edition of my up-coming Shipset OXP. A gang of pirates (7,8,9) can slow the computer to a near halt! It seems to be mostly pirates...I don't know if that AI is particularly resource-hungry, because, say, an Anaconda with half a dozen escorts doesn't do this. I also noticed this a bit with Deepspace Ships which also uses 2048 graphics. I'm glad I'm doing a SD edition as well...looks like I'll end up using it myself!

[JensAyton]

A 2048 × 2048 texture with mip-mapping uses 23.3 MiB of memory, plus administrative overhead. On a 128 MiB graphics card, having more than, say, three such textures plus several others within rendering range will cause texture swapping, i.e. a need to re-upload textures from main memory for each frame. This can easily happen in such a way that every single texture needs to be re-uploaded, potentially more than once.

[pagroove]

Welcome back! Hope you stay longer now Now where is that other feline who sold those pets?

[caracal]

No they don't, but they do appear on the advanced compass as 'C'. When you go to them from the witchpoint (in the latest version) they are always oriented 90° to the witchpoint.

Ah, I hadn't thought of that. So it sounds like I could use the witchpoint beacon as a sort of rough buoy for them. Thanks, I'll try it!

As to the CPU usage question I had, which seems to have gotten the most attention:

Also, I recall 1.71 and 1.72 using a relatively minor amount of CPU time when running. Now, though, 1.73.4 uses about 50% continuously, which still doesn't have any visible effect on the rest of my system, but it does wake up my CPU cooling fan to start its roaring.

This is probably due to the extra work that shaders require.

and

It could be something like having bigger and more complicated ships in a system thats increasing CPU load? Slowdowns are often caused by too many objects.

and further

This can easily happen in such a way that every single texture needs to be re-uploaded, potentially more than once.

Maybe I'm wrong, but ... if it were graphics-related, wouldn't it drop off noticeably when I was in-station, when the only thing being displayed was a page full of the price of furs?

But anyway, nice to see an old hand back!

Thanks, JazHaz! Nice to see such an energetic and constructive new hand has joined the commOonity!

[caracal]

Welcome back.

Thank you most kindly, Captain! It's good to be back.

[caracal]

Hey caracal, good to see you back!

Thank you kindly! It's great to be back on the friendliest board this side of Riedquat. Or that other side, which has always been a bit sketchy if you ask me.

(No, my sig has been like that since ages )

I know: I spent time reading the forum before posting my message. Was honored that an respected Intergalactic Spam Assassin would find my humble words worth repeating.

[caracal]

I run a WinXP system myself, and get similar CPU load with 1.73.4 - should I ?

Thanks for the data. This is "good" news in the sense that (a) it's less likely to be my setup, and (b) it's less likely to be specific to Linux.

I'm just wondering if the app is maybe doing something the developers didn't expect it to do. I remember once when I was starting to use a new GUI toolkit, I tried one library call that let me "wait for events" and argh! My CPU was pegged at 99%. So I switched to the other kind of wait-for-event call, and the usage dropped to zero, or as close as didn't matter. So maybe there's some new call they're using that brings its own unwanted baggage that wasn't mentioned in the manpage. Just speculating; I've looked at the code, and am sorry to say that ObjC makes my brain bleed, so I won't be any help there. I have nothing but admiration for those who are willing and able to wrestle with it.

[caracal]

Welcome back!

Thank you kindly, O enhancer of stations! It's great to be back.

Hope you stay longer now

Me too, and it's very good of you to say so.

Now where is that other feline who sold those pets?

Yeah, where is that guy?! I bought a special present just so I can thank him warmly. Lessee, what does it say on the label? "M-I-L-I-T-A-R-Y ..." Oh well, I'm sure he'll love it!

[JazHaz]

As to the CPU usage question I had, which seems to have gotten the most attention:

Also, I recall 1.71 and 1.72 using a relatively minor amount of CPU time when running. Now, though, 1.73.4 uses about 50% continuously, which still doesn't have any visible effect on the rest of my system, but it does wake up my CPU cooling fan to start its roaring.

This can easily happen in such a way that every single texture needs to be re-uploaded, potentially more than once.

Maybe I'm wrong, but ... if it were graphics-related, wouldn't it drop off noticeably when I was in-station, when the only thing being displayed was a page full of the price of furs?

But when you are in station, things still happen outside. Ships still fly about and attack each other. That's why you occasionally get calls for help etc. Try pressing Shift-F before docking, and watch the FPS/Objects counts change whilst docked.

But anyway, nice to see an old hand back!

Thanks, JazHaz! Nice to see such an energetic and constructive new hand has joined the commOonity!

I do what I can, can't code or draw for toffee, but can make wiki pages!! Glad someone has noticed!