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Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2022 10:41 am
by Cholmondely
Table of Contents for this Thread

(Key: + indicates a more recent addition, below this ToC)


Original Battleplan (3 posts) with additions for possible v.2.0 & v.3.0


Station Geography

Coriolis Stations
Coriolis Interior: Phantorgorth's Sketches/descriptions after ToC
Coriolis Interior: Lore descriptions
ML's response re size/accessibility

Dodos
Dodo size & accessibility

Icos
Ico population & accessibility below Dodo

Rock Hermits
Varieties & internal locations (mining bases, smuggler's dens & pirate coves)
Pirate coves
Non-oxygenated RH's - musings on Limbo's suggestion

Rock Hermit Lounges
HoloStims & activities

Ideas for handling maps
Rough guide or programmed under Complex changes


Factors affecting Stations
Species at bottom of post
Govt type and likely businesses at bottom of post
+Govt type and effects on station architecture/encounters/events

Communist Systems


Individual Systems
Digebiti
+Lave
Zarece
Musings: I suppose that the priorities should be the first systems a new player would visit: Diso/Leesti/Riedquat/Reorte & Zaonce/Tionisla/Isinor. Diso & Leesti are not in the Rough Guide.

Individual Locations inside a station

Bars & Restaurants, Food & Drink
List of names, random generators
Descriptions of Bars (Jameson's ad)
More Musings about pubs
Individuation by decor/collections/clientele/drinks
Description for inclusion

Bookshops
Bookshops with links to books
•Books (Intro to Cheesy Wotsit)
•Books (Cheesy Wotsit, Elements of Plumbing, Manetho & Euclid)
•Books (cim's Ship's Manual on sociology & history)
•Books (Combat Manoeuvers)

Churches
Witchspace Lobster
St Giles with extra added blue cheese
Randomius Factoria, Happy Eye, Zenarchy, Black Monks of St Herod
Waterlogged Witchspace Lobster variant for aquatic worlds

Government Offices (People's Palace, Viceroy's Palace etc).
Govt Offices - what do they do?
+Govt Offices - different names and guards
and see Factors affecting Stations: Communist Systems above for list of tourist office museum contents and notes on where they might be
+Different names for different systems and their corresponding guards

Stationmaster's Offices
Location depends on Govt system at bottom of post

Other venues
List under simplest changes


Random Encounters
Random encounter generators
Edited & expanded random encounters text
+Thinking about Encounters

Ancillary Considerations
Station populations

Slot Machine/Fruit Machine/One-armed bandit (links to free code)

Using the ship's mediStim bay This might be better done via a separate .oxp

Musings on a Docked HUD for LitF
ML's response re Docked HUD

Major issue of F3 shipyard activity downtime being lost for LitF purposes Might this need a vanilla code tweak?

+Sounds (bottom of post)

+Phkb on integration with other oxp's
+Flying Dutchman oxp's premature bar visit

Old ideas

Some further goodies from the thread above:
Mohawk's bumping into someone you interacted with in space before docking
Ffuture's wish to spend the F3 shipyard downtime in LitF activities
Mohawk's F3 shipyard downtime, view contracts etc in LitF, getting hurt
Ngalo's differentiating between RH's
Libervuto's juicier deals in the bar
Norby's addition of names, Station Dock Control & Sell-All seedy buyers
PAGroove's inclusion of Station Dock Control, contracts & HOopy games
Sundiver's Hunt the Wumpus (would be better with a Trumble, I think!)
[/quote]

Layne wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2015 3:52 pm
This is one of those projects that could benefit a lot from a 'stone soup' approach. As it is, the framework is interesting but very incomplete, and there's not enough random events, outcomes, and missions to sustain interest for long. If the author ever returns and the engine got a proper re-working, everyone in the community could contribute a few events each to it and really flesh it out. I'm not just talking ideas, I mean, actually send a few paragraphs of text descriptions each (those who feel comfortable with writing, that is, and from the looks of things around here that seems to be quite a few) to the creator for use in the oxp. The creator adds them in, and before long an oxp with twenty random events has fifty, or a hundred, or more, with everybody interested pitching in a little.

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
[/quote]

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
by Cholmondely
Ship names, formatting, station variation, mystery of the missing lobbys, music cutting out

Ship Names
Massively Locked wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:49 pm
Cholmondely wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 1:05 am
3) Ship Names and the Definite Article

My current ship is named "Spirit of Digebiti" rather than "The Spirit of Digebiti". Alas, when named by LitF, one sees inelegant cicumlocutions such as "You're in the hanger where Spirit of Digebiti is parked" or a choice of "Go to the Docks" , Embark on Spirit of Digebiti, etc.

I suspect that there is no simple solution to this. Might putting the name of the ship in quotes ease matters slightly? "You're in the hanger where 'Spirit of Digebiti' is parked" or a choice of "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on 'Spirit of Digebiti'", etc.


Or am I being too pedantic? After all, I did not name my ship "The Spirit of Digebiti"!
I debated this when I first mashed the ship name into the code. I've yet to come up with a universal solution. Suppose we force the use of "The". What happens when we have a ship named, "A Sunrise Over Lave"? We wind up with: "You look over and see The A Sunrise Over Lave parked by the hangar door." Most of the time, it seems appropriate to address ships with "The". Working out when it's not will be a challenge. Something to continue mulling over.
I wonder if use of quotes might not be the best solution for this issue.
Or maybe use of "your" - your Spirit of Digebiti?
Or even both: your 'Spirit of Digebiti'?


"You're in the hanger where 'Spirit of Digebiti' is parked" ----- "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on 'Spirit of Digebiti'"

"You're in the hanger where your Spirit of Digebiti is parked" ----- "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on your Spirit of Digebiti"

"You're in the hanger where your 'Spirit of Digebiti' is parked" ----- "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on your 'Spirit of Digebiti'"



And where The is included in the ship name:

"You're in the hanger where 'The Spirit of Digebiti' is parked" ----- "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on 'The Spirit of Digebiti'"

"You're in the hanger where your The Spirit of Digebiti is parked" ----- "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on your The Spirit of Digebiti"

"You're in the hanger where your 'The Spirit of Digebiti' is parked" ----- "Go to the Docks" , "Embark on your 'The Spirit of Digebiti'"

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Formatting

Don't forget to post examples of formatting (eg selected lines of the Digebiti/Zarece texts).

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Station Variation

Just looking at BB's Italian notes on this:
Station Navigation
Il giocatore avrà la possibilità di girare all'interno della stazione in cui è atterrato, passando da una locazione all'altra e da un livello all'altro, tramite l'uso di ascensori.

La mappa della stazione sarà determinata dal tipo di governo del sistema, mentre l'economia ed il livello tecnologico modificheranno i nomi di alcune locazioni.

The player will have the opportunity to explore inside the station where he landed, going from one location to another and from one level to another, through the use of elevators.

The station map will be determined by the type of government of the system, while the economy and the technological level will change the names of some locations.

Code: Select all

L0 - Ship Level 		
hangar 	 	Hangar. 	
docks 	 	Docks. 	
storage 	Storage Area. 	 	 	GALSHOPPING
corridors 	Maintenance Corridors. 	 	GALSHADY

L1 - Production Area 		
production 	(1) 	 	 	 	GALGOVERNMENT

L2 - Civic Area 		
houses 	 	(2) 	 	 	 	GALCIVIC
library 	Library. 	 	 	GALBOOK
square 	 	Public Square. 	 	 	GALCIVIC
alleys 	 	Alleys. 	 	 	GALSHADY
mall 	 	Mall. 	 	 	 	GALSHOPPING
church2 	Church. 	 	 	GALCHURCH

L3 - Entertainment Area 		
medical 	(3) 	 	 	 	GALMEDICAL
church3 	Faith Center 	 	 	GALCHURCH
museum 	 	Natural Museum. 	 	GALCULTURE
gallery 	Art Gallery. 	 	 	GALCULTURE
cinema 	 	Cinema Hall. 	 	 	GALCULTURE
opera 	 	Opera House. 	 	 	GALCULTURE
wwvt 	 	WildWorld Virtual Tour. 	GALNATURE
bmarket 	Black Market. 	 	 	GALSHADY

L4 - Tourism Area 		
lounge 	 	Passengers Lounge. 	 	GALTOURISM
hotel 	 	DeLuxor Hotel.  	 	GALTOURISM
shop 	 	Souvenirs Shop. 	 	GALSHOPPING

L5 - Administration Area 		
gccenter 	GalCop Center 	 	 	GALCOP
prison 	 	GalCop Detainment Zone 	 	GALCOP
palace 	 	(4) 	 	 	 	GALGOVERNMENT
Areas which change:

(1) L1 Production area on station:
Industrial economy: Robot Factories / Replicating Factories / Nano-Assembly Lines (TL: low, medium, high).
Agricultural economy: Commune Farms / Hydroponic Farms / Protein-Cloning Centers (TL: low, medium, high).

(2) L2 Housing:
Common Hives / Apartments / MegaCondos. (TL: low, medium, high).

(3) L3 Medical Centre:
First-Aid Center / Public Clinic / Hospital (TL: low, medium, high).

(4) L5 Palace:
Soviet Palace (communist) / Empire Palace (dictatorial)

note addition of L1 Production area - does this make sense for a regular orbital station?


Other goodies lifted from the Italian notes on BB's website:

1) Add advertising items relating to the service facilities inside the station. Allow the player to go around the station until he reaches them. Use the structures to pass a variable amount of time to the player.

2) The generation of different layouts for the stations depending on the parameters of the system in which they are located.
Note: moving the Govt Offices, their Tourism Office/Museum, and the Stationmasters office as suggested in previous posts will help facilitate this. Adding in stuff for other species (Rodentine Breeding arenas, etc) will also help. As, say, execution chambers for the Commies and the Dictators. And moving the churches to less conspicuous locations for, say, Commies, Corporates and some Dictators.

3) LOCAL missions/activities:
GALCOP: Shooting range
GALCOP: Melee combat gym
GALCOP: Citizen patrol
GALBOOK: Selling used books.
GALCHURCH: Church rites.
GALCHURCH: Church services.
GALSHADY: Black market.
GALCIVIC: Social services.
GALTOURISM: DeLuxor Hotel.
GALNATURE: Wild Word Virtual Tour.
GALNATURE: Natural Museum.
GALNATURE: Art Gallery.
GALNATURE: Opera House.
GALNATURE: Virtual Cinema.
GALGOVERNMENT: Propaganda.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

The mystery of the Lobby

It looks to me as though Norby took it out for his final revisions (or just possibly BB when he made the map visible from every lobby in v.0.7).

There was originally going to be a lobby on every floor:

Code: Select all

       +-- L1 Lobby -- Docks Area -- [Ship]
       |
       +-- L2 Lobby --+-- Maintenance Area
       |              |
       |              +-- Storage Area
       |              |
       |              +-- Cargo Area
       |
Lift --+-- L3 Lobby --+-- Main Concourse A
       |              |
       |              +-- Main Concourse B
       |              |
       |              +-- Main Concourse C
       |
       +-- L4 Lobby --+-- Entertainment Area
       |              |
       |              +-- Physical Activities Area
       |              |
       |              +-- Intellectual Activities Area
       |
       +-- L5 Lobby -- GalCop Precinct
but SteveKing persuaded BB that the lobby on the hanger levels should be called the "dock" instead.

If you want to follow this up, just type "lobby" in the "Search this topic" box on the top left of this page.


_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Music cutting out

When disembarking from my ship the music (both the station chatter from BGS and the music from Arquebus's Contextual Jukebox OXP) cuts out. Is this desired?

BGS & BGS Soundset by P.A. Groove both provide different sounds for some of the different F screens (F3, F7, F8...). Keeper has yet another soundset (see BGS wiki page). There are also libraries of free sounds on the web which (eg) Phkb has raided for effects.

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:49 pm
by Redspear
Massively Locked wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:49 pm
I debated this when I first mashed the ship name into the code. I've yet to come up with a universal solution. Suppose we force the use of "The". What happens when we have a ship named, "A Sunrise Over Lave"? We wind up with: "You look over and see The A Sunrise Over Lave parked by the hangar door." Most of the time, it seems appropriate to address ships with "The". Working out when it's not will be a challenge. Something to continue mulling over.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
I wonder if use of quotes might not be the best solution for this issue.
Or maybe use of "your" - your Spirit of Digebiti?
Or even both: your 'Spirit of Digebiti'?
Consider that writers rarely always refer to a character by name, or at least not the same name.

Hamlet was 'Prince of Denmark', 'the King's son', then 'the King's nephew', and someties simply 'Hamlet'.
Or in a somewhat different genre (and indeed prose)... Conan was the 'barbarian', the 'Cimmerian', etc.
'Millenium Falcon', 'Falcon', 'piece of junk', you get the idea I think.

Instead of 'your Spirit of Digibeti', how about simply, 'your ship'?
Using its name some of the time is quite nice but all of the time could be a bit wearing...

"Request docking clearance for your ship", is rather dull compared with, "Request docking clearance for Spirit of Digibeti".
But then, "Board Spirit of Digibeti", is a bit gradiose and even clunky compared to, "Board your ship".

Horses for courses perhaps but "your ship" seems likely to be the safe bet if I were to have only one available.

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2022 6:17 pm
by cbr
Image

perhaps 'straight vertical lists' ...

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2022 6:29 pm
by Cholmondely
cbr wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 6:17 pm
Image

perhaps 'straight vertical lists' ...
If that is a shot of what I think it is, then that list is just for the development version so that one needs not go chasing all over the station to find the bookshop...

But I'll bear it in mind when next trying out LitF.


Any ideas for adding to it? Pub descriptions? Encounters? Ideas for making corporates seem more corporate? Flavour text?



And what is that unusual looking ship you just posted over in The Shipyard at the End of the Ooniverse? Have you started modelling?

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:08 pm
by cbr
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 6:29 pm

And what is that unusual looking ship you just posted over in The Shipyard at the End of the Ooniverse? Have you started modelling?
Now and then I enter the dimensional path, I have a few... :roll: :lol:

If you remove the shield ships you can see the original idea/role as dedicated aurora escort ships...

Image

Tbh I got lost in the station...
What could be done?
1] subtle text added to the background image
2] a mini map ( you are here )
3] a quick key shows the layout of the current station

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
by Massively Locked
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 10:41 am
Table of Contents …
Thanks for pulling this together. Saves me from having to sift thru page after page to find a piece of info.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
Ship Names
Redspear wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:49 pm
Horses for courses perhaps but "your ship" seems likely to be the safe bet if I were to have only one available.
All good ideas, and I'm going to go with answer D: "All of the Above." I'll randomize it so you'll see "'Spirit of Digebiti'" or "The 'Spirit of Digebiti'" or "your 'Spirit of Digebiti'" or just "your ship" or even something else I've yet to think of. We'll all try it out & see what we like or not.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
Formatting

Don't forget to post examples of formatting (eg selected lines of the Digebiti/Zarece texts).
Haven't forgotten. I'm currently coding a routine to process your Digebiti content. I also have a few other ideas regarding the handling of text constants. All this is directly related to how we store and organize the data. Once things are working, I write up how the formatting should be.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
Station Variation

Just looking at BB's Italian notes on this:
I took a look at his site. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't most of it (the english passages at least) already on the Revival page? Another thing- I didn't see an e-mail address anywhere. Let me know if I missed it.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
note addition of L1 Production area - does this make sense for a regular orbital station?
Sure- why not? I see some stations having many and others having few or none.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
The mystery of the Lobby
I'd say leave it as it. If we change it, we'd have to re-do the map graphic. Graphics work takes up moar time than editing directions in the descriptions.
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
Music cutting out
Still on my list. I am a big fan of the BGS background chatter. If you come across any sound clips that you really like, make of note of it & let me know.
cbr wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 6:17 pm
perhaps 'straight vertical lists' ...
The left-aligned text looks good, and I can see situations where it would work better. I'll work on some coding for it when I get a moment.
cbr wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:08 pm
Tbh I got lost in the station...
What could be done?
1] subtle text added to the background image
2] a mini map ( you are here )
3] a quick key shows the layout of the current station
The only station I intentionally designed to be a bit confusing was the rock hermit. But then Cholmondely went wandering around for days without food and water, so I quickly nailed some wooden signs to the rock walls. :-) As development continues, we'll add directories and navigational aids. Maps are a good thing, but as I wrote above- they just take a lot of time to do. Still, I may try to make a basic map(s) & see how that works for everyone.

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:46 pm
by Cody
Massively Locked wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
"your 'Spirit of Digebiti'" or just "your ship" or even something else I've yet to think of.
"Your [ship-class] Spirit of Digebiti" (as in "Your Adder Spirit of Digebiti") or just "Your Adder"?

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:38 pm
by Cholmondely
Massively Locked wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
Just looking at BB's Italian notes on this:
I took a look at his site. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't most of it (the english passages at least) already on the Revival page? Another thing- I didn't see an e-mail address anywhere. Let me know if I missed it.
Oops! I so much preferred this earlier version that I never bothered going through the Revival Thread!
Massively Locked wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
Cholmondely wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 12:18 pm
Music cutting out
Still on my list. I am a big fan of the BGS background chatter. If you come across any sound clips that you really like, make of note of it & let me know.
I wonder if it might be easier to copy the sounds into LitF, add in a few more (bars, concerts and things) and sort the problem that way? We already have the 3 BGS variant oxp's with background sounds which we can presumably pillage.... Be nice to have some good sounds for the changing of the guard at Digebiti outside the Viceroy's Palace...
Massively Locked wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
Graphics work takes up moar time than editing directions in the descriptions.
cbr wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:08 pm
Tbh I got lost in the station...
What could be done?
1] subtle text added to the background image
2] a mini map ( you are here )
3] a quick key shows the layout of the current station
The only station I intentionally designed to be a bit confusing was the rock hermit. But then Cholmondely went wandering around for days without food and water, so I quickly nailed some wooden signs to the rock walls. :-) As development continues, we'll add directories and navigational aids. Maps are a good thing, but as I wrote above- they just take a lot of time to do. Still, I may try to make a basic map(s) & see how that works for everyone.
I am hoping and praying that cbr is bamboozleable into creating new maps for LitF. We may need to give him his very own Coriolis, though...

cbr! Where do you want it - and what do you want to have in it? Red lobsters?

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:22 pm
by cbr
Massively Locked wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
The only station I intentionally designed to be a bit confusing was the rock hermit. But then Cholmondely went wandering around for days without food and water, so I quickly nailed some wooden signs to the rock walls. :-) As development continues, we'll add directories and navigational aids. Maps are a good thing, but as I wrote above- they just take a lot of time to do. Still, I may try to make a basic map(s) & see how that works for everyone.
Pfew, if even our battlehardened digibetian tourguide instructor gets lost :oops:

At the moment I have no idea(s) regarding mapmaking ( probably the simplest idea will work best ).
I do like the classic text adventure structure of Life intheF

Idea for visiting the hangars perhaps a second hand f3 equipment type thing makes it more interesting visiting the hangars / when visited the hangars...

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2022 10:38 pm
by Cholmondely
cbr wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:22 pm
Massively Locked wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:33 pm
The only station I intentionally designed to be a bit confusing was the rock hermit. But then Cholmondely went wandering around for days without food and water, so I quickly nailed some wooden signs to the rock walls. :-) As development continues, we'll add directories and navigational aids. Maps are a good thing, but as I wrote above- they just take a lot of time to do. Still, I may try to make a basic map(s) & see how that works for everyone.
Pfew, if even our battlehardened digibetian tourguide instructor gets lost :oops:

At the moment I have no idea(s) regarding mapmaking ( probably the simplest idea will work best ).
I do like the classic text adventure structure of Life intheF

Idea for visiting the hangars perhaps a second hand f3 equipment type thing makes it more interesting visiting the hangars / when visited the hangars...
So:

i) but it was fun getting lost!

ii) We'll be adding a handful of things into the map (eg the Gubernatorial Palace which changes name according to the politics of the system) and also hope to have different layouts for different systems and different species (rodentine mating theatres, communist execution vacuum chambers etc.). So actually... its a mess! A glorious festering mess! Probably best solved with a software map which can change according to the circumstance, but who knows if we have the ability to programme it... wanders off, whimpering profusely and tearing out his hair in handfuls... Who says that pirates and Thargoids are the threat? Codswallop. More pilots die wandering around lost and starving inside the orbital stations than ever fall in combat...

iii) Incorporating hangers is pencilled in for LitF v.2.0 (plan for v.2.0: incorporate other relevant oxps affecting station geography as well as the F3/F4/F8 screens -and start making inroads into the .oxp stations). See top of the ToC at the top of this page.

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Assorted Issues with v.0.06


1) Glitch - visiting the bar and nattering with the bar-creature (Isinor RH - but that is presumably now irrelevant):
The blue frog bartender pours a glass of liquor and you start chatting. After a bit the bartender tells you: 'They say that Loou Beerzanu the $SPECIES_$ is looking for somebody wearing your sort of jacket. Watch Out!'.


2) Pondering your additions:
"A $SPECIES_S$ runs across your path. You hear him saying into his comm-link: Meet me back at the hangar. We're the third $Ship$ on the left.",
"An voice on the PA system announces a depressurization drill on section 3 of deck 5.",

Super snippets. But! Might it make more sense to randomise 'third $Ship$' with first, second, fourth, etc.? And 3 & 5 likewise?


3) Sounds: I really like the deep bass grinding F3 & F3F3 shipyard sounds from BGS (which has 134 sounds in it - maybe half to do with the station? ...for the various docked screens, etc.).
PAGroove's BGS addon is almost all related to flight - but has an almost 5 minute-long music file for on-station. Note the restrictions in his license.
Keeper's BGS addon has nothing particularly different.

Just discovered: https://pixabay.com/sound-effects/searc ... 20station/

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2022 5:03 pm
by Cholmondely
Additions for 0.07

I'm afraid that my understanding of code is not good enough to work out what I need to copy in v.0.06 re the description of the Govt Palace.

So here is some more brainstorming. Feedback, please!

Govt Offices:
Corp: ($System Name$) Executive Bureau (same floor as GalCop Precinct)
Dem: Governer's Offices (same floor as GalCop Precinct)
Conf: Governments' Offices (same floor as GalCop Precinct, but smaller)
Commie: People's Palace (same floor as GalCop Precinct, but tourist office/tourist museum may be elsewhere for poorer systems)
Dictatorship (agri: Junta): Council for National Reconstruction Bureau (not so sure about this name!)
Dictatorship (ind'l: Imperial): Viceroy's Palace
Multi-Govt: Governments' Embassies (probably all different and on different floors, too disunified to run anything) - maybe easiest to say that they can't be bothered affording it for only a shared partial control (unless that govt is the only one on the planet to pay towards the GalCop orbital).
Feudal: Viceroy's Palace (same floor as GalCop Precinct for richer systems, a cheaper floor for poorer systems)
Anarchy: nothing! zippo!

Outside the offices are guards.
Corp: Police from Downplanet
Dem: Police from Downplanet
Conf: A mix of 1+ Policemen, 1+ Peoplespolicepersons, 1+ soldiers, 1+ Imperial Hussars,
Commie: Peoplespolicepersons with Thought Police in wait behind the arras
Dictatorship (agri: Junta): Soldiers
Dictatorship (ind'l: Imperial): Imperial Hussars
Multi-Govt: Each separate embassy will have the appropriate guards, if any exist.
Feudal: Royal Hussars or Uhlans or Houseguards or Cossacks or Dragoons.
Anarchy: nothing! zippo!

More on maps
How about a map just giving floors and levels but not details of locations (bars, churches, etc.)

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2022 8:51 pm
by cbr
Cholmondely wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 5:03 pm

More on maps
How about a map just giving floors and levels but not details of locations (bars, churches, etc.)
Only floors and levels how do you picture this?

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2022 9:04 pm
by Cholmondely
cbr wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 8:51 pm
Cholmondely wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 5:03 pm

More on maps
How about a map just giving floors and levels but not details of locations (bars, churches, etc.)
Only floors and levels how do you picture this?
The map as it stands but without the far right-hand section listing bar/hotel/opera house etc.

But that's not the point, is it? The point is this - would it stop you getting lost (presuming that you are told which area you are in)?



Oh - and cbr - do you think that the ico & dodo need maps too? Or is the geography obvious enough?

Vanilla game Icos are found at Aona, Edinso, Edle, Inera, Inines, Teraed, Usrarema, Zaatxe, & Zaonce in Galaxy 1,
Vanilla game Dodos are found at Aleusqu, Arxeza, Biarge, Bierle, Ceesxe, Cevege, Enonla, Ensoreus, Entizadi, Gerete, Lerelace, Malama, Onlema, Onrira, Ororqu, Rexebe, Riredi, Sorace, Tianve, Tionisla, Veisti & Xexedi.

Re: [WIP] Life in the Frontier OXP

Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2022 1:34 am
by Cholmondely
Government Types - brainstorming

Govt Offices already dealt with


1) Corporate States
Inspiration from Imprint
•Lots of advertising everywhere (take company names from wiki & YAH ads). Probably lots of repeat blanket ads from the biggest corporations to stop the others grabbing any of the spaces!
•Lots of sponsorships. "Free trips" downplanet to visit the factory and salesroom of a corporate business located in the middle of nowhere with a tied-in hotel and beach...
•Trade names dominate such things as lists of bar drinks.
•No (or hardly any) independent businesses
•Lots of busy corporate executives buzzing around the orbital


On hold awaiting assimilation of Redspear's Revelations

Revelatory Redspearean Rejig:
•Just the one corporation (add in some systems with more than one for v.2.0?)
•Advertising to go down and visit the planet (the Corporation benefits from every penny you spend!)
•Advertising for the Corporation facilities on the station (the more expensive bars, hotels, restaurants, etc)
•"Free trips" downplanet to visit the factory and salesroom of a corporate business located in the middle of nowhere with a tied-in hotel and beach...
•Trade names dominate such things as lists of bar drinks.
•No (or hardly any) independent businesses
•Lots of busy corporate executives buzzing around the orbital
•Corporate Security Guards rather than police
•Lots of poor beggars who can't get jobs - or who got up to the station and then lost their jobs. Could this be where the religions help out?
East India Company law courts initially consisted (1600's) of a lawyer and two merchants
•The Corporates control everything - their own police, their own navy, their own lawcourts, their own communication services, their own banks etc. Everything that somebody does is known to the local corporation. The only time there is any oversight is when they are operating outside of their own systems under another government. Is it due to the Corporates (allying with Commies & Dictatorships) that GalCop will not intervene in solar systems? Democracies might well oppose this, and the other political groupings would be too divided or too weak to influence matters.

2) Democracies
•Domination (but less) by the large corporates as above.

Station Architecture
•Visit the local government offices and listen to a riveting debate (such as the thrilling details of refurbishing the water supply to section 27:3:q).

Events
•At election times, lots of election advertising for the various candidates/parties and local pop-up party HQ's
•Peaceful protests about whatever (worms in the tap water/ too many lockdowns/ improve education for the children/ subsidised flights down planet/ arrest a specific scoundrel for misdemeanours etc.)
•Political Debates in public spaces
•Witness an assassination of somebody important. Or hear the Tannoy announcement.

Encounters
These religious encounters should only occur if one of the missionaries packages is installed. And not just at democracies but at confederacies, multi Gov's, Feudals & anarchies too (ie just five of the eight).
• What's The Happy Eye? Don't know. Brainwashed smiling faces offering their pamphlets at spaceports and on stations? (Murgh updated their spiel in his Iron Ass Missionaries).
•Other missionaries (CGC, HWG, Zenarchy monks, etc.).


3) Confederacy
Mix of the rest - probably tending to the top of this list
Nobody in overall control. Need to work through the implications of this.
I suppose that I see Confederacies, Multi-Govs and Anarchies as being in their own continuum, moving from confederated disparate groups who get along to raving anarchic nutters who don't. In each case, GalCop effectively runs the orbital station, conferring with the Confederacies who cooperate enough to maintain offices up by the GalCop precinct - to MultiGovs where each Gov has its own offices in the entrails of the station (and fighting might well break out between the different groups) - to Anarchies who have zippo. In reality it would be much more nuanced, but this might do for now. The problem is a heartfelt desire not to bother naming/describing the dozens of different governments for each of the 32 Multi-Govs in Gal1! Working out Zarece (with 3 named cloud cities out of 15+) was bad enough!

Overall based on democracies but without the electioneering (it's not really their station and the various other countries might well disapprove of it taking place in their "shared space")

Station Architecture
•Apart from no opportunity to eavesdrop on political debates inside the Govt Offices, I envision no major differences from Democracies.

Events
•Witness an assassination of somebody important. Or hear the Tannoy announcement.

Encounters
•As for democracies


4) Commies
Inspiration from Captain Hesperus's write up's on the wiki & Ships that pass in the night
As mentioned above, Commies are competing with GalCop for control of the orbital station. See there for notes on the docking process and details of individual systems.
With commies.oxp loaded, they also have their own stations (if rich enough) and police force/navy: both police and thought-police! There are escaping convicts from the Astrogulags. Commissars whizzing around in limousines. Worker's commuters packed full of hordes of a bedizened proletariat off to perform Stakhanovian feats in the factories and orbital stations.

•Station includes an Execution chamber for disposing of the regime's enemies - a glass-walled area inside a hallway/public space where the enemies are exposed to the vacuum with everybody watching.
•Station includes a People's Arena for sporting events and public addresses (rallying the workers). Cordoned off when not in use.
•Fewer restaurants/pubs for the locals as they are mostly fed in work canteens - which also stops them mixing so much with foreigners.
•Businesses are all part of GOoM or equivalent.
•Screens in public places blaring out agitprop. Maybe use the billboard images from the Commies oxp? And Laeninpropaganda.jpg?
Possible billboards of the glorious leader (there are 100+ little images hidden inside Library.oxp)
Supreme Comrade Rattski?: Image

Encounters
People's Policepersons (and Thought Police in mufti) all over the place keeping tabs on what goes on. Occasional GalCop arbiters who can intervene if the commies step over the line. How about Policepersons outside all churches, for example, with GalCop arbiters turning up if there is a service going on? Or see a conversation taking place in a hallway- and then suddenly the Policepersons turn up and drag all but one (the Thought Police stoogie) away, screaming and kicking? Or see a group of 1-12 Policepersons exit a side corridor with 1-6 handcuffed citizens, moving towards the lifts?
•Police/Police arresting somebody/Police arresting somebody else/Police threatening somebody/Police marching somewhere/Police marching to the People's Palace with arrested suspects/Thought Police (in mufti) calling in police to arrest somebody/Thought Police (in mufti) arresting somebody/Thought Police (in mufti) threatening somebody
•Political refugee begging for safe passage out/Political escapee begging for safe passage out
•Family member/lover/chum of escapee wishing to send a message to escapee on system x.
•Possible encounter with commissar's entourage who push everybody out of the way - or possible sighting of them from a distance in a large hallway or some such.

Events
Acclamation of Stakhanovite worker in Arena and over station Tannoy/Political march (in approval of the wonderful government-against local evil system-against evil capitalists-against capitalist GalCop-against letting in foreigners)/Public Execution in vacuum chamber/March of the Trades Unions for MayDay or equivalent)
Some of this might better wait until putative integration with Diplomancy OXP which creates wars/alliance


5) Dictatorship
Inspired by Flavour Expansions (2006)
Very similar to Commies above - but the dictatorships tend to be a little poorer/weaker and Juntas are not co-ordinated throughout the galaxies whilst the Imperials are not co-ordinated as well as the commies are.
Docking process for each of these as per commies above. It's just that the people meeting you off your ship wear different uniforms!


5a) Junta (Agricultural)
Are there Imperial Astrofactories for the agri-Juntas? I think so, but...
Junta enforcers, Revolutionary guards. Prison ships?

Station architecture
•Station includes an Execution chamber for disposing of the regime's enemies - a shooting range in a public space where the enemies are shot by a firing squad with everybody watching. the family are charged for the bullets if they want the body back afterwards.
•Station includes a National Arena for sporting events and public addresses (rallying the people). Cordoned off when not in use.
•A number of the businesses are owned by the army/navy.
•Censored bookshops
•Screens in public places blaring out agitprop. Possible billboards of the Generalissimo (there are 100+ little images hidden inside Library.oxp)

Encounters
Same as commies. Note that there are no police or commissars. Just army/navy.

Events
Acclamation of the Generalissimo in the Arena and over station Tannoy/Political march (in approval of the wonderful government-against local evil system-against evil commies-against commie GalCop-against letting in foreigners)/Public Execution/March of the Army-Navy for Coup d'Etat day or equivalent) - make it "Random" whether Orbital is run by the army or the navy?
Some of this might better wait until putative integration with Diplomancy OXP which creates wars/alliance


5b) Imperium (Industrial)
Imperial Astrofactories, Imperial Censors, Imperial Lictors, Imperial Quaestors, Prison ships, Imperial Freighters & Imperial Tankers.
Unsure whether each planet has its own emperor or whether they are all part of the same Empire. This seems to have been left vague.

Station architecture
•Station includes an Execution chamber for disposing of the regime's enemies - electrocuted standing up.
•Station includes an Imperial Forum for public addresses (rallying the people). Cordoned off when not in use.
•A number of the businesses are owned by imperial sycophants.
•Censored bookshops
•Screens in public places blaring out agitprop. Possible billboards of the Emperor (there are 100+ little images hidden inside Library.oxp)

Encounters
Same as commies. Note that there are police and secret police.

Events
Acclamation of the Exalted Emperor in the Forum and over station Tannoy/Political march (in approval of the wonderful Emperor-against local evil system-against evil commies-against commie GalCop-against letting in foreigners)/Public Execution/"Triumphs" - display of military prowess)
Some of this might better wait until putative integration with Diplomancy OXP which creates wars/alliance


5c) Theocracy: Church of the Holy Witchspace Guard (Mainly Industrial) - awaiting Montana05's .oxp
High Temples (converted Tetrahedra), Orders Squire, Orders Knight, Orders Paladin. Church Cleric Craft, Church Pilgrim Ships. (See here).

Station architecture
•Station includes an Execution chamber for disposing of the regime's enemies - under a lens massively magnifying the rays of the sun - they go up in a puff of smoke!
•Station includes a Cathedral with a Courtyard for public addresses (rallying the people).
•A number of the businesses are owned by the church.
•Shops selling religious artefacts (for services, for pilgrimages, icons for the home, etc.)
•Censored bookshops
•Screens in public places blaring out agitprop. Possible billboards of the High Priest (there are 100+ little images hidden inside Library.oxp)
•The only churches are HWG - others are hidden away and will have the Inquisition on guard outside!

Encounters
Same as commies. Note that there are police and the inquisition.

Events
Acclamation of the High Priest in the Cathedral Courtyard and over station Tannoy/Political march (in approval of the wonderful Church-against local evil system-against evil heretics-against heretical GalCop-against letting in foreigners)/Public Execution/"Pilgrimages")
Some of this might better wait until putative integration with Diplomancy OXP which creates wars/alliance


6) Multi-Government
Mix of the rest - probably tending to the bottom of this list
Nobody in overall control. Need to work through the implications of this.
With Factions.oxp there are shooting matches between the various political groupings. With Free Trade Zones.oxp there are converted RH's by the Witchpoint beacon. "Free Trade Zones exist because of the highly complex legal nature of Multi-Government planets, their collective paranoia over perceived sovereignty infringements by GalCop, and their general inability to make collective decisions"


7) Feudal states
With feudal states oxp there are Royal Hunting Lodges at the more advanced feudals for jousting/gambling as well as the Royal Court on the planet beneath (11/32 in G1, 12/32 in G2). Missions to collect tribute from the remaining lesser feudal states. Knights jousting in Jägers, Korvettes & Zerstörers.
As well as the nobles, the established church - if any - will have much influence/power. We already have the Church of Giles the Creator (CGC) and that of the Holy Witchspace Guard (HWG). Also the Witchspace Lobster church on Lobstoid worlds with the right political complexion. I'm not sure that any of the others qualify. If you want to include Randomius Factoria, I'll want to rewrite the wiki page!

Station architecture
•Possibility for some/all feudal orbitals: The station area is broken up into fiefdoms, under the influence of various feudal lords from down beneath. The main area (BB's Coriolis Map) is under the King and his trusted Viceroy, but other areas (quadrants? sestieri? - other sides of the Coriolis) are controlled by others. GalCop try and keep the peace between them.
In such a case there would be flags/coats of arms showing allegiance to the various quadrants, as well as regular games between them (think Italy: annual horse race, annual regatta, etc. For feudal orbitals say annual archery competition, or an annual tug-of-war competition, or an annual shooting competition, or an annual barrel-rolling competition, crossbow contest, flagwaving contest, choral contest, football match, jousting, fencing, or Oolite sports match).
I like this approach, but if it is true for Feudals, it should also be true for Multi-govs and at least some Confederacies too. I think the naming and labelling would be a disaster waiting to happen
•Cathedrals?
•Viceroy's Palace with moat?
•Statues of various nobles/senior clerics, lots of coats of arms on doorways for example.
•Quirky shops/businesses
•Guilds which dominate their local business sectors. Impressive Guild houses (think Venice).
•Square for duels?

Encounters
•Nobles/Prelates with entourage and guards
•Ladies with entourage and guards
•Guildmasters
•Squabbling knights
•Beggars

Events
•Duels?
•Annual parade of nobles, knights, guilds etc.
•Tournaments as mentioned above.
•Pilgrimage (arrival of downplanet pilgrimage to visit the holy relic of St <Random>'s kneecap in the Cathedral).


8) Anarchy
Station architecture
•Since the station is run by GalCop only, one might expect the big corporates to dominate business matters as they can pay for the privilege (but not totally control them as they do in their own corporate states)!
•There might be one or two of the wealthier "countries" downplanet who can be bothered to afford minor counsulates up on the station. Not sure that they are worth bothering with for v.1.0.

Encounters
•The religious encounters from democracy above would be less frequent than in the other systems due to the regular destruction of their ships by the surrounding pirates.
•Pirates. Smugglers. Ne'er-do-wells. Rapscallions. Ragamuffins.

Events
•Occasional riots?
•Stuff inspired by Redspear's brilliant rework of Solo's Alt Stations (Tannoy calls duplicating his proto-Coriolis broadcasts).


This post is a WiP!

Musings.

If we can incorporate some of this - and then cross-match it with the differences due to species - and the Rough Guide planets - we will have a lot of predictable variety and also some unpredictable variety (the way it should be, I think). Adding in the fine detail (eg Commie tourist office museum displays) could wait for v.2.0.

Rough Guide has some 18 systems. We can add to them Digebiti and Teorge which also have a lot of lore.

When we finish, I will have added to the Rough Guide pages (see Laenin!). Maybe we should publish the updated version as a Ship's Library book to download and to read in the bookshops!