Shimmery graphics

Ivan · Post by **Ivan** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:29 am

I just got a Dell E6400 and it's not too happy with Oolite. All runs ok except that textures seem to slide about and shimmer when objects move. It's difficult to describe, but it sort of looks like small bits of textures are inverted, like a big/little endian mixup.

According to Everest, the specs are: Intel GMA 4500MHD, 1GB video adapter RAM, 2GB system RAM, OpenGL 2.0.0.

Anyone seen something like this before?

Rustybolts · Post by **Rustybolts** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:28 pm

Yeah sounds like the same thing i get using my netbook intel gma 950 on board graphics.

Ivan · Post by **Ivan** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:41 pm

That's a tad annoying. Have you found any way to reduce the problem? I'm not sure what settings are tweakable for this, either in Oolite or for the GMA "chip".

Rustybolts · Post by **Rustybolts** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:50 pm

Ivan wrote:
That's a tad annoying. Have you found any way to reduce the problem? I'm not sure what settings are tweakable for this, either in Oolite or for the GMA "chip".

The only thing i did was to use oxps with less complex graphics. But that effect was mostly seen on griff con store in Your ad here, so i installed version 3 basic package it uses a less complex con store model. Although i still run System redux works fine. Most other addons have been o.k.

Cmdr Wyvern · Post by **Cmdr Wyvern** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:51 pm

Sounds like the Intel GPU doesn't want to play nice. Have you tried updating the drivers?

Rustybolts · Post by **Rustybolts** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:58 pm

Cmdr Wyvern wrote:
Sounds like the Intel GPU doesn't want to play nice. Have you tried updating the drivers?

Doesn't annoy me enough to bother trying

Ivan · Post by **Ivan** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:47 pm

It's only a few weeks old and the drivers are pretty up to date. On space stations the decorative circle round the docking hole gets mucked up, with horizontal bands blanked out. It looks like a vertical retrace kind of effect, but only on that bit of decoration, the rest of the space station is fine.

It's odd but livewithable. It's a work computer so I daren't mess too much with it.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 7:50 am

That looks like 'Z-Fighting' - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z-fighting
the easiest fix would be to adjust the adjust the z position of the arc subentites of the coriolis in the shipdata.plist in order to move them further away from the polygons that make up the station, with more of a gap between the polygons the z-fighting should go away

Ivan · Post by **Ivan** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 2:30 pm

Thanks Griff. Googling around found some hints that DirectX 9 doesn't handle z-fighting well, and that's what's on this PC. That could well be the problem. Dxdiag says that all DX files are either 2001 or 2004, which doesn't look brilliant for a 2009 PC.

Diziet Sma · Post by **Diziet Sma** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:39 pm

Ivan wrote:
Thanks Griff. Googling around found some hints that DirectX 9 doesn't handle z-fighting well, and that's what's on this PC. That could well be the problem. Dxdiag says that all DX files are either 2001 or 2004, which doesn't look brilliant for a 2009 PC.

Hmmm.. it's interesting that some stuff in DX9 is so old, but it's not relevant to Oolite, as it happens... Oolite doesn't use DirectX, but OpenGL instead.

zevans · Post by **zevans** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:23 pm

Hmmm.. it's interesting that some stuff in DX9 is so old, but it's not relevant to Oolite, as it happens... Oolite doesn't use DirectX, but OpenGL instead.

On many Windows boxes the OpenGL drivers are but a thin veneer over the DirectX drivers, so you might well be using DirectX after all... in cunning disguise.

KZ9999 · Post by **KZ9999** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:34 am

Do a driver update check at Dell, Intel and Microsoft's websites.

Having worked in the retail computer business for far too long; I can tell you that when you buy a brand new computer, that parts of the software image it comes with can be many months old. Manufactures only update their install images when a provider releases a major version point update or push a major bug fix out. The manufacturers won't include minor updates for things as it is just not economic for them to do so. I got in to the habit of telling customers to do a system update with all hardware and software venders in the first few days of ownership.

I say do the three because if my memory serves me correctly, the OpenGL drivers come from Intel directly. Check Dell too as they have a habit of adding their own version of them for their own needs. Microsoft would be last, as Windows will only the OpenGL wrapper for DirectX when it can't find the hardware venders version.

Diziet Sma · Post by **Diziet Sma** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 2:06 am

zevans wrote:
Hmmm.. it's interesting that some stuff in DX9 is so old, but it's not relevant to Oolite, as it happens... Oolite doesn't use DirectX, but OpenGL instead.
On many Windows boxes the OpenGL drivers are but a thin veneer over the DirectX drivers, so you might well be using DirectX after all... in cunning disguise.

Now that I didn't know! Thanks zevans!

Ivan · Post by **Ivan** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 10:28 am

KZ9999 wrote:
I got in to the habit of telling customers to do a system update with all hardware and software venders in the first few days of ownership.

I say do the three because if my memory serves me correctly, the OpenGL drivers come from Intel directly. Check Dell too as they have a habit of adding their own version of them for their own needs.

I updated the GM4500 driver, which was almost up to date anyway, but it didn't alter the issue. DirectX up to date as I understand it (9.0c), which leaves OpenGL.

It's reported as Version 2.0.0 - Build 7.15.10.5029 (Intel Cantiga renderer). That doesn't seem too new going by Wikipedia - any advice on how to update it?

KZ9999 · Post by **KZ9999** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 11:07 am

Ok. I don't know if you have visited the following pages, if not give them a try.

For Intel's auto-detect web page for the graphics system model check and driver update.

Direct X is actually up to DX10 now, so to get the latest version for your system head to windows update if it supports it.

Here is a couple of driver website that are also worth trying: No Device and Driver Agent. Be warned, both will try to get you to download software to 'automatically update your drives.' Just use them to find out if there are driver updates, and follow the links to download them manually.

Hardware makers own fourms are a good place to poke around for solutions too. Most are almost as friendly as this very one. Just try a broad search terms like 'z-fighting' and see what turns up.

My final bit of free advice is don't rely on wikipeadia for driver information as it will never be as up-to-date as the manufactures own pages. Save the download software/drivers pages for the various hardware manufacturers to a folder in your browser. For the next year check them on a monthly basis (the standard warranty period.) and every 3 months after that for the next two years (the standard working life of a pc.)