Mr B

ClymAngus · Post by **ClymAngus** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:35 pm

Just a quick question, (as it doesn't appear to be on the wiki) How come David B hasn't nailed us to the nearest wall for copyright violation?

MKG · Post by **MKG** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:12 pm

For copying what, exactly?

Someone will jump on me if I'm wrong, but as far as I understand these things, the code is completely from scratch - so no violation there. Appearance? He'd have to have a go at a lot of other derivative games too. Concept? No-one could successfully defend a claim that a space trading and combat game originated with Elite.

It would be pointless - probably the only thing he could have a go at is original ship design - but then that would be a waste of time because the response would be to withdraw those designs and substitute others. I'm sure he has better things to do - like dream on about Elite 4.

Mike

FSOneblin · Post by **FSOneblin** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:35 pm

ClymAngus wrote:
Just a quick question, (as it doesn't appear to be on the wiki) How come David Braben hasn't nailed us to the nearest wall for copyright violation?

Shhhh, Don't give him any ideas.

FSOneblin

Frame · Post by **Frame** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:37 pm

ClymAngus wrote:
Just a quick question, (as it doesn't appear to be on the wiki) How come David Braben hasn't nailed us to the nearest wall for copyright violation?

I think it is one of those mutual understandings that they will get more bad will than good will if they shot down another free project. Also we are not using the copyrighted name Elite

I´ll try to explain...

Back in 2001-2004/ I was a member of the mod Galactic Conquest that was a Star Wars mod for battlefield 1942.. Initially it was named something with the branded name Star Wars, which lead Lucas Arts, to prompt us to change the name or retract the project... They could have shot us down at any moment they wanted to, but acknowledged that they should not behave like a "firm" to fans... since this project was completely non profit, internet based... and the CD that people could order with the mod on it, was priced to cover the production cost only.. This was only for the first release..

We renamed it to Galactic Conquest... and everything was well. We could use names like the Tie-fighter, X-wing designations at our pleasure, but was of course not permitted to use branded names like Luke Skywalker or Darth Vader. as these are undeniably related to the branded star wars name..

Without having the slightest clue to why frontier games has not stopped this project as they did with Elite TNK (The New Kind), I think it comes down to that this project does not use any of the branded names apart from of course commander Jameson, which is a general name that I bet that you cannot brand.

I Think it is more trouble than it is worth to shut down this project too. I bet frontier got a lot of angry mail when they shut down TNK.

At least for me as a consumer I have chosen to not buy games from certain companies or their affiliates, because of some Act of theirs that made me deem them, untrustworthy and certainly not a company I would support by buying any of their products...

For me, in regard to them if they would be shutting down Oolite too, would totally make me aware to not ever buy any of their products in any foreseeable future of mine or theirs.

The power of the consumer is invisible, however, bad will, can very well kill any company.

But in the end, I think, as long as branded names are not directly used, we are fine...

Captain Hesperus · Post by **Captain Hesperus** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 12:42 am

And further more, if someone from Frontier did take offence to the fact that Oolite used the same polygon-shaped ship models, it would be a small fix to replace the basic set.

Captain Hesperus

Screet · Post by **Screet** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 12:49 am

Captain Hesperus wrote:
And further more, if someone from Frontier did take offence to the fact that Oolite used the same polygon-shaped ship models, it would be a small fix to replace the basic set.

...a work that already is in progress, resulting in much better looking ships, as any reader of simons thread can witness!

Anyway, that guy should rather be happy with the impact his old game had upon the people.

Furthermore, Frame put it well to words: "I think it is one of those mutual understandings that they will get more bad will than good will if they shot down another free project. "

Recently some german politician found that there was wrong (and bad) info placed about him in Wikipedia. He had his lawyer shut down the german portal. The result was so immense that surely noone ever in germany will attempt the same thing again. That man practically destroyed his career with it. In some cases, lawyers might be a good idea, but the people do notice when they are applied in the wrong fields, doing more harm than good.

Screet

Cmdr Wyvern · Post by **Cmdr Wyvern** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 2:17 am

As another example of good business turned bad and hostile to customers:

The RIAA, now infamous for deliberately damaging customers equipment (The rootkit virus CD fiasco), illegal intrusions (ie hiring unlicenced gumshoes to break into computer systems), threats against customers, and last but certainly not least, suing kids, sick people, old people, homeless people, dying people and dead people.

They're not call the MafiAA for nothing.

Screet · Post by **Screet** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 2:30 am

Cmdr Wyvern wrote:
As another example of good business turned bad and hostile to customers:

The RIAA, now infamous for deliberately damaging customers equipment (The rootkit virus CD fiasco), illegal intrusions (ie hiring unlicenced gumshoes to break into computer systems), threats against customers, and last but certainly not least, suing kids, sick people, old people, homeless people, dying people and dead people.

They're not call the MafiAA for nothing.

Guess why I practically stopped buying CDs. Only rarely, directly from the artist, nothing else anymore. They shall suffer! I bought roughly a thousand CDs until copy protection came up...maybe they won't notice a single person to stop buying, but I'm sure that I'm not the only one behaving that way.

However, Mafia...sometimes I fail to understand their bad image. Few times it turned out that the socially well behaving people who care for others I came to know have that sort of background. Didn't take their job offers, though, and was surprised when one of them said "Many greetings from CIA! You've got poor survival instincts, but that could be fixed". On the other hand, it's documented that CIA worked with such people in the past. Well, those guys were entirely not what you'd expect them after watching TV, more like the "maybe it's illegal, but somebody has to do it and it won't harm anyone" type.

Screet

ClymAngus · Post by **ClymAngus** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 2:40 am

Cmdr Wyvern wrote:
As another example of good business turned bad and hostile to customers:

The RIAA, now infamous for deliberately damaging customers equipment (The rootkit virus CD fiasco), illegal intrusions (ie hiring unlicenced gumshoes to break into computer systems), threats against customers, and last but certainly not least, suing kids, sick people, old people, homeless people, dying people and dead people.

They're not call the MafiAA for nothing.

If it comes to this, we will hide, we will endure. Such is the nature of brits and like minded compatriots.

0235 · Post by **0235** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 10:28 am

i think that why he hasnt shut oolite down because it is a path of elite which takes it to the future, so its kind of reliving the glory days, and if it was shut down, then they would have to speed up th release of elite IV

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 11:15 am

Nah. Truth is that what we are doing is no direct copyright violation, so he can't shut it down. That would change for instance the very moment when anybody would start to charge something for Oolite (which is, I think, what happened to Elite: The Next Kind). Which is why Oolite's license is how it is, which effectively prevents anybody from charging anything. Which in return prevents B. from taking action.

ClymAngus · Post by **ClymAngus** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 11:16 am

Screet wrote:
Guess why I practically stopped buying CDs. Only rarely, directly from the artist, nothing else anymore. They shall suffer! I bought roughly a thousand CDs until copy protection came up...maybe they won't notice a single person to stop buying, but I'm sure that I'm not the only one behaving that way.

Copy protection? Righty ho so how does that stop anyone capturing instead of ripping? Nice set of gold phonos into a mini-jack and the jobs a good-ern. I would have thought.

Cmdr Wyvern · Post by **Cmdr Wyvern** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 4:31 pm

ClymAngus wrote:
Screet wrote:
Guess why I practically stopped buying CDs. Only rarely, directly from the artist, nothing else anymore. They shall suffer! I bought roughly a thousand CDs until copy protection came up...maybe they won't notice a single person to stop buying, but I'm sure that I'm not the only one behaving that way.
Copy protection? Righty ho so how does that stop anyone capturing instead of ripping? Nice set of gold phonos into a mini-jack and the jobs a good-ern. I would have thought.

Righty. Copy protection doesn't do squat to deter a media pirate willing to break or work around it. It only penalizes and annoys the hell out of legit customers.

Alas, that's the message that the music moguls just aren't getting.

JensAyton · Post by **JensAyton** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 5:33 pm

Cmdr Wyvern wrote:
Alas, that's the message that the music moguls just aren't getting.

You clearly haven’t been paying attention recently. ;-) DRM on music is now effectively dead. Time to focus on the movie industry…

ClymAngus · Post by **ClymAngus** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 5:42 pm

Ahruman wrote:
Cmdr Wyvern wrote:
Alas, that's the message that the music moguls just aren't getting.
You clearly haven’t been paying attention recently. DRM on music is now effectively dead. Time to focus on the movie industry…

There is the problem that if your sences can capture it, then chances are other things can too. "I'm sorry, you do not have the nessessary clearance to view this media. Please stand still whilst we heat lance your eyes and ears and extract the wetware copy of it from your brain via hatchet labotomy."

Oolite Bulletins

Mr B

Mr B

Re: Breadbin

Re: Breadbin