Can't dock.

[vaxon]

The ship always crashes when I try to dock, although the speed and direction are fine. Looks like the dock model is wrong in the Linux version (1.65 / 1.69). It is impossible to enter a station.

[winston]

Really? I've not had a problem with it myself.

Quite some time ago, the collision detection when docking was made significantly better, but this was before 1.65.

[TGHC]

did you mean 1.68/1.69

[vaxon]

I've tried 1.65 and 1.69 only.
I build it from sources and looks like there's something wrong with the dock model. I had to modify a couple of faces in the .dat file to make it work. I've built on FC3 and RH9 and both have the same problem. It's not the collision detection. It's like the dock is always locked.

[TGHC]

I'm a windows user <sigh> but I don't recall any problems with 1.65 it was very stable, a reinstall might fix the problem. 1.69 is being debugged, praps some other linux users can shed some light for you, as Winston said he has no problrms with 1.65

[JensAyton]

There were problems with the dock between 1.68 and 1.69. One of the last things I did for 1.69 was fix the docking which, in my tests, works perfectly. I don’t know why it would be different under Linux. :-/

[heikki III]

The ship always crashes when I try to dock, although the speed and direction are fine. Looks like the dock model is wrong in the Linux version (1.65 / 1.69). It is impossible to enter a station.

I had the same problem, running Debian Etch and KDE. Then I installed the nvidia drivers, and suddenly it was much easier to dock! The frame rate went from 4-5 to 30-50, and that made everything work so much smoother.

It seems that the control keypresses are also read only once per frame. With so small frame rate, steering is almost impossible, as all corrections are awfully big. I bet that is so deep in the game logic, that it can not be changed easily...

(Also, I noted funny graphical effects on the planet surfaces, large triangular patches in various directions, and stars shining through the planet. All that went away when switched the display driver)

For other newbies, here is what I needed to do:

Code: Select all

  sudo apt-get install nvidia-kernel-2.6.18-4-k7 nvidia-kernel-common nvidia-glx nvidia-settings

Then change a line in /etc/X11/xorg.conf: Instead of Driver "nv", put in Driver "nvidia". Restart your X (I rebooted the whole box), and voila, it works!

Now I just need to sort out the incantations for the ATI drivers, so I can play at home as well as at work...

[Cmdr. Maegil]

Oh, and vaxon, I noticed that even though you registered almost a month ago, these were your first posts.

Being so, we couldn't extend our welcomes before, but will do it now.

</me clears throat and sets up baritone voice>

WEEEELCOME to the friendliest boards this side of Riedquat!!!

[TGHC]

chuckles

[Cmdr Wyvern]

Regardless of platform, Oolite requires OpenGL hardware acceleration and doesn't play well with software rendering at all.
Once you have the GL acceleration up and running, you're cookin' with premium grade quirium.

...That's been my experience anyhow.

[heikki III]

Regardless of platform, Oolite requires OpenGL hardware acceleration and doesn't play well with software rendering at all.

Would it be possible to add a feature to reduce the amount of displayable things to the bare minimum? Sure the game would not look as great, but at least it could be made playable that way. There is already a setting about reduced detail, perhaps that could be expanded to cover values from 'no detail' to 'reduced' to 'fine' to 'extreme'. Then everyone could play on what level their hardware (and drivers) allow. After all, the original Elite was quite playable with much weaker hardware than what is available today. Or so I hear...

I fear that by giving a horrible first-time experience to beginners, we scare them out, and they never learn the noble art of docking, for example.

Maybe the developers have a good reason not to implement this, their job, their choice, of course...

- Heikki

[JensAyton]

Would it be possible to add a feature to reduce the amount of displayable things to the bare minimum?

Yes, but it would be bad design and a bunch of extra work, with little gain. Adding extra options and tweak factors is a Bad Thing from a user experience point of view, and there’s just no way the game could be made to run fast with software rendering.

Besides, the inability of Linux distros to provide working 3D drivers even when they exist is clearly a UE problem, but just as clearly not our problem. The appropriate response is to put a note about this in the Read Me file.

After all, the original Elite was quite playable with much weaker hardware than what is available today.

This is a pointless comparison. Quantifying just how pointless results in numbers that are so ridiculous I won’t even bother with them, but it boils down to this: to produce something that looks like BBC Elite and has comparable system requirements, it would be necessary to rewrite every single part of the game, drop all compatibility with OXPs, and end up with a completely different game that very few people would want to play.

[Cmdr Wyvern]

If your hardware isn't quite up to the task of handling Oolite plus 100-odd OXPs, then the reduced detail option can be very useful.

Sure, Elite ran on weak, oldschool hardware, yet Bell & Braben pulled off a technical miracle in packing that much into software that could run in a few kilobyes of ram and if you were lucky a 1mhz proccessor, without slowing down too much. Granted they did it without textured models and highpower 3D cards, but that stuff wasn't invented yet.

Otherwise I ditto Cmdr Ahruman, who knows the code far better than I.

[heikki III]

Would it be possible to add a feature to reduce the amount of displayable things to the bare minimum?

Yes, but it would be bad design and a bunch of extra work, with little gain. Adding extra options and tweak factors is a Bad Thing from a user experience point of view, and there’s just no way the game could be made to run fast with software rendering.

Of course, you are the guys actually developing this thing, so it is your call. But may I respectfully suggest that a game that fails to work is also a Bad Thing. If you really think you should require 3D acceleration, the Right Thing would surely to check for it in the beginning, and refuse to launch the program at all, if the requirements are not there. Starting the game with 3 fps and broken textures is not good.

Besides, there is already a tweak factor, "Reduced detail", which at the moment doesn't seem to make much of a difference. (and screen resolution, and even sound volume - those are tweaks many people expect from a game, and can handle)

Besides, the inability of Linux distros to provide working 3D drivers even when they exist is clearly a UE problem, but just as clearly not our problem. The appropriate response is to put a note about this in the Read Me file.

Well, my home workstation, originally bought with no thought for gaming, has a built-in graphics card (VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RS480 Radeon Xpress 200G Series ) that does not support dri and other fancy things. I can get an acceptable frame rate in the lowest possible resolution, but the planets always look totally strange when I get closer. If they could just be displayed as a textureless circle, I would be happier...

I will get me a decent card, and drivers, and stop complaining. But I bet there are many who try the game, and give up, without ever getting to the point of video drivers.

But, as I said, it is you who develop it, so it is your call.

Regards

Heikki III

[TGHC]

Over the years updated or new OS/games/applications etc have always required more memory/diskspace/better graphics cards/CPU's, it would be retrograde to design a game to work on old systems, the whole point of Oolite is to harness the power of new hardware.

That said, with the introduction of some of the more meatier OXP's and improved graphics capabilties it would be helpful to offer guidance as to the minimum spec system that would be needed to run the game. I know LB does a lot of testing an a fairly low spec m/c.

So just for a change, rather than brag about who's biggest and best, who is running the lowest spec system and getting satisfactory results?