For the love of god, yaw thrusters please!

Parkingtigers · Post by **Parkingtigers** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:16 pm

Hi chaps.

Downloaded Oolite ages ago, only the other day did I actually get around to playing it. Glorious stuff, and I've grabbed a whole bunch of expansions and I'm going to spend the weekend pimping it out.

My one wish though, is please please please can someone write an expansion that adds yaw thrusters to the game. I know it isn't exactly true to the original Elite, but the whole pitch and roll only combat just limits me severely. Seems rather arbitrary not to have it. Hell, I'd gladly have it be a purchasable upgrade, call them maneuvering thrusters or something.

Okay, I admit, docking is a pain in the bum as well. It just feels like the stations are too small. I'm going to wait until I've tried the expansions, but I'd love to see the stations become MUCH larger. Oh yes.

Nitpicks aside, I'm delighted to see such a great conversion and with such great expandability. Well done to all concerned, hope to see it go from strength to strength in the future.

But please, yaw thrusters anyone?

LittleBear · Post by **LittleBear** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:21 pm

Welcome to the boards. Think yaw thrusters are in 1.68 onwards, but I'm not sure what the controls to use them are. If you want big stations, try the Tourus OXP. Make sure you get the OXPs from the Wiki here: http://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/OXP as some of the versions on Oosat1 and Oosat2 are old (and sometimes buggy!) versions.

The links on the Wiki page will always take you to the lastest version, as it's this page the modders update. Oosat1 and Oosat2 cannot be updated any more (and haven't been for quite a while), so when modders update an OXP (often to fix a bug thats been reported on the boards), its this page that gets updated. The "short description" on the table will tell you if the OXP has been updated over a version on either Oosat1 or Oosat2. Eventually, I get round to adding the version number to this page) but I haven't got round to it yet.

Captain Hesperus · Post by **Captain Hesperus** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 6:09 pm

LittleBear wrote:
Welcome to the boards. Think yaw thrusters are in 1.68 onwards, but I'm not sure what the controls to use them are.

They are , and . for yaw left and yaw right respectively.

Captain Hesperus

Parkingtigers · Post by **Parkingtigers** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 5:51 pm

My wish is granted? Nice!

Interesting though, because just before making this request I had downloaded the latest version from the main page and strangely it seems to be only 1.62. I'll try and snaffle it again to go to the latest version number, because yaw thrusters are pretty much essential. Strange that the link didn't give me the newest one, but maybe it was my mistake when moving the files around on my Mac.

I've grabbed nearly all the OXPs as well, I particularly liked being able to immediately downgrade to a rusty Cobra III with all the trimmings. Nice. The larger stations would really help, nothing more frustrating than jumping into a system, killing a few pirates and spending 30 minutes travelling to the station only to crash when docking.

Am I alone in finding that the roll controls don't seem to rotate around a centre point? Feels more like, when stationary, that when I push left that the crosshairs are moving in a small circle rather than rotating on the spot as it were. Coupled with the really tiny docking ports of the stations, I've spent more time crashing than flying it seems.

Not that it hasn't put me off trying though.

JensAyton · Post by **JensAyton** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:10 pm

Parkingtigers wrote:
Interesting though, because just before making this request I had downloaded the latest version from the main page and strangely it seems to be only 1.62.

Which particular main page is that? We’ve got at least four.

Parkingtigers · Post by **Parkingtigers** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:14 pm

Ahruman wrote:
Parkingtigers wrote:
Interesting though, because just before making this request I had downloaded the latest version from the main page and strangely it seems to be only 1.62.
Which particular main page is that? We’ve got at least four.

Really? That alone might explain it. I'm grabbing it again as we speak, plus the "beta" 1.69 from another page. Got about 5 minutes of battery left as I'm in a pub in Hong Kong right now, will have to test it and report back later.

LittleBear · Post by **LittleBear** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:24 pm

On docking, its not so much that the ports are small, but you have to be lined up properly or you'll catch the sides and explode. Fly straight to the Nav Beacon rather than the station. Come to a dead stop right next to it. Now roll so the Station's "golf-club" is lined up with it. Now drive to bring the station into view. You should be perfectly alined with the docking port. You can even dock on injectors this way! as you enter the port though, keep tapping the roll keys so your roll keeps pace with the roll of the station.

Captain Hesperus · Post by **Captain Hesperus** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 7:04 pm

LittleBear wrote:
On docking, its not so much that the ports are small, but you have to be lined up properly or you'll catch the sides and explode. Fly straight to the Nav Beacon rather than the station. Come to a dead stop right next to it. Now roll so the Station's "golf-club" is lined up with it. Now drive to bring the station into view. You should be perfectly alined with the docking port. You can even dock on injectors this way! as you enter the port though, keep tapping the roll keys so your roll keeps pace with the roll of the station.

As LB says, you can dock with injectors on once you've got the hang of it. Verrrrrrry useful if you are an unremittant Fugitive. <quick whispered discussion with grey-suited brief> Ahem. Which I am not.

Captain Hesperus

Helvellyn · Post by **Helvellyn** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 8:26 pm

Far too easy a cop-out! Trying to dock whilst blasting Vipers used to get the door shut on you. It's these bloody health and safety laws, can't shut the door on a crook, he might crash into it

Pitch and roll is fine for combat, if you redefine the keys to something sensible (e.g. the original Elite setup). I have the left and right arrow for yaw, but don't use it in combat. IMO they are at their best with mouse control, but I don't like Oolite's mouse control method (or I've missed out on some configuring trick there) so usually stick to the keys.

Cmdr. Maegil · Post by **Cmdr. Maegil** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 11:55 pm

Hi, Parkingtigers. You'll eventually get the hang of parking your Tiger without (much of) a dent - but starting with a Cobra MkIII is considered easier as they're so much smaller...

I see in you location that you're exploring the far East. By what means, may I ask? Are you a hitch-hiker, a flyer, or a sailor as myself? Whatever the case, welcome to our pirateless boards!
(Thar be pirates 'ere, but them arn't allow'd to go a-piratin' on da premises. Arrr!)

Commander McLane · Post by **Commander McLane** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 12:02 pm

Parkingtigers wrote:
Am I alone in finding that the roll controls don't seem to rotate around a centre point? Feels more like, when stationary, that when I push left that the crosshairs are moving in a small circle rather than rotating on the spot as it were. Coupled with the really tiny docking ports of the stations, I've spent more time crashing than flying it seems.

The roll controls do rotate around the center point. But in most ships your viewpoint (your "ship's window", although the ships of course don't have windows) is not centered. As in almost every means of transport the drivers's eyes are somewhat eccentric. So in your view it looks like the roll isn't centered. You have to consider the eccentric viewpoint especially when attempting to dock with a large ship. Then you should aim at a point way above the center of the dock.

(And that may be an explanation for many of the scratches on the Dubious Profit.

)

Captain Hesperus · Post by **Captain Hesperus** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:15 pm

Commander McLane wrote:
(And that may be an explanation for many of the scratches on the Dubious Profit. )

No that's entirely pilot ineptitude....

Captain Hesperus

Parkingtigers · Post by **Parkingtigers** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:55 pm

Right, well I got the correct 1.65 Oolite file this time. Those yaw thrusters in the test 1.69 seem to to do the trick. It is always nice to see that stuff that is requested has already been thought of by someone else.

The next logical step as regards to fine-tuned movement, would be make it a single button that switches from pitch and roll, to yaw and ... whatever it would be that would move the craft vertically up and down. Docking thrusters? When I'm pointed at the docking port, but it is to one side and lower for example, it is an awful lot of rotating, pitching, (now some yawing) then accelerating just to get things lined up. If I could move sideways, and up and down, then that could be very handy. Especially when it is combined with a slow flight towards the port. Get lined up, fly forward, mess up on the rotation (again), lose aim, hit the docking thrusters to quickly get me lined up again, switch back to rotational controls.

That is what I would find ultimately useful.

By the way, when I used the newer version of Oolite some of my other OXPs kicked in and some of them are just awesome. I particularly enjoy things that make the game prettier like the grittier space station. That is beautiful. Are there any plans to take things like this and fold them into the main game itself? Be nice to see all the hard work that is known to work without issues get absorbed into Oolite. I'm probably not alone in having not even thought of looking for expansions when I first downloaded. Obviously all the ships and things could be contentious, but thanks to things like these forums you have ways to look for feedback, conduct polls, etc. Some of these graphical patches are top notch though, well done to all concerned.

Sorry to disappoint Maegil, I'm not a sailor by the way. I'm just bumming around the Far East looking for a place to settle right now. England wasn't working out for me, so I sold my house, quit my job, bought a one way ticket for the other side of the world. Spent 3 months in Thailand, and I've been in Hong Kong (which is AWESOME) for the last 6 weeks. Going to be here for the next few months looking for ways to make it permanent.

Oh one more thing. I'll mention it here rather than clogging up the forums with my nonsense. A simple addition that would be nice would be ship names. Ships have got to have a name, right? Enterprise, Millenium Falcon, Serenity. All the coolest ships in sci-fi have names, so just flying a generic ship class is never going to be the same. Just give me a chance to enter a name when I buy a ship and I'll be a happy lad.

Extending that idea, how about making some kind of ship's log? Nothing fancy, just a page of statistics charting a career. Number of ships killed, number of bounties collected, total bounties collected. I'd be happy to draw up a list if someone else could code it.

My incoherant ramblings should make it obvious that I'm in the pub drinking Guinness. I like these forums, seems like a friendly place.

Post by **Disembodied** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:15 pm

Hi Parkingtigers. As regards getting lined up on the station, as LittleBear says above the best way is to use the Navigation Beacon that sits in a direct line between the station's docking bay and the planet's surface. Ignore the station, just home in on the beacon; position yourself so that it's directly between you and the planet, then stop engines. Tilt up from here towards the station and you should find yourself looking straight down the docking bay's gullet. From there on in all you have to do is match the rotation. We never had anything like these Navigation Beacons back in the old days: they're a godsend, I tell you. (And if you install the Commies OXP, you'll find that the beacons in Communist systems carry inspirational posters, urging the proletariat towards -- or perhaps away from -- this, that or the other.)

JensAyton · Post by **JensAyton** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:20 pm

Parkingtigers wrote:
The next logical step as regards to fine-tuned movement, would be make it a single button that switches from pitch and roll, to yaw and ... whatever it would be that would move the craft vertically up and down.

Er… yaw doesn’t move you left and right, y’know. The vertical counterpart to yaw is pitch. Lateral thrusters are very definitely not happening, because they would require us to abandon all semblance of the original Elite flight model.