Oolite Starter Not Enabling Expansions (Or Oolite Not Recognising ManagedAddOns Folder)

[Hendorne]

Hi, I've recently installed Oolite 1.9.0 and Oolite Starter 0.1.32 on Windows. I have the version set up and selected in Oolite Starter with all the directories mapped. I can install expansions from the left column into the right column under the expansions tab, and I have also made sure that there are no conflicts and that required expansions from dependencies are installed. When I check into my ManagedAddOns folder, the expansions are all there, but when I start Oolite, it starts without the mods. I confirm this by saving the game and checking the save list in the Start Game tab, where the save file has no expansions listed in the expansions field.

Somebody on the Discord provided me with a work around by suggesting I move the expansions from the ManagedAddOns folder into the AddOns folder, which now has the mods working in Oolite. However, I know that this isn't the intended way for Oolite Starter to work. Based on this, it might seem that Oolite isn't recognising the ManagedAddOns folder for whatever reason.

I'll list all the information for directory paths from the Versions tab below.

Home Directory = C:\Oolite\oolite.app
Version = 1.90
Executable = C:\Oolite\oolite.app\oolite.exe
Savegame Directory = C:\Oolite\oolite.app\oolite-saves
AddOn Directory = C:\Oolite\AddOns
Deactivated AddOn Directory = C:\Oolite\DeactivatedAddOns
Managed AddOn Directory = C:\Oolite\ManagedAddOns
Managed Deactivated AddOn Directory = C:\Oolite\ManagedDeactivatedAddOns
Debug Console Protocol = unticked
MQTT = unticked

[another_commander]

Based on this, it might seem that Oolite isn't recognising the ManagedAddOns folder for whatever reason.

Just to be sure that there is no misunderstanding here: Oolite was never meant to recognize a folder named <OoliteInstallDir>\ManagedAddOns. This folder appears to be used exclusively by Oolite Starter and has no influence in the game itself.

I'll post the correct managed add-ons path here, as soon as I get to a PC with access to the source code.

Edit: Here is the default managed addons path:
<OoliteInstallDir>\oolite.app\GNUstep\Library\ApplicationSupport\Oolite\ManagedAddOns
You may want to try feeding that to Oolite Starter.

[Hendorne]

Edit: Here is the default managed addons path:
<OoliteInstallDir>\oolite.app\GNUstep\Library\ApplicationSupport\Oolite\ManagedAddOns
You may want to try feeding that to Oolite Starter.

I'll give this a try, although it appears a little different than on the GitHub page for Oolite Starter that has screenshots. In the screenshots on the GitHub page it mentions GNUstep as a folder that contains an Application and Library folder, and that application folder is what contains Oolite and the Home Directory for it. Unless that's for Linux or Mac, since the only GNUstep folder I have is the one inside the oolite.app folder like the one you listed.

Edit: This seems to have worked. Thank you very much, another_commander!

[Cholmondely]

Hi,

PM awaiting thy perusal!

[Gargery]

In December I decided to have a go at Oolite again after some years. I suppose there are reasons for changing the way Oolite Expansions are handled even though it makes things more difficult. I, like Hendorne, immediately found that the OoliteStarter does not work on Microsoft (I'm not going into why I'm using Microsoft) in fact I have difficulty in understanding what it's for, because it just seems to confuse the issue. I had followed the advice and set up C:\Oolite\ManagedAddOns etc., exactly as Hendorne described, to save the expansion libraries. I guess we were following the same advice. I found that by ignoring OoliteStarter I could get some expansion packages to work to some extent, but the purpose of the four directories
C:\Oolite\AddOns
C:\Oolite\ManagedAddOns
C:\Oolite\DeactivatedAddOns
C:\Oolite\ManagedDeactivatedAddOns
remained (and renains) obscure. Following another_commander's advice and moving the directories to
<OoliteInstallDir>\oolite.app\GNUstep\Library\ApplicationSupport\Oolite\
makes them work reliably -- up to a point!

The planets and stations look great, but the problem is that Hyperspace jumps don't work any more. Pressing the H key gives the message, "Target system restricted" and nothing else. I suppose one of the Expansion Packages is responsible, I'm just not sure I can be bothered to start debugging something that was supposed to be a recreation. I have found no description of this phenomenon in a few searches, but I wondered if anyone could throw any light on it.

[another_commander]

Quite a bit to unpack here. Let's see...

There has not really been any official change in the way expansions are handled, other than the site where expansions are now downloaded from. That's it. Oolite Starter is just a helper utility, which you can use if you want or not - it does not affect the way the game handles OXPs. If you think that it is confusing or that it complicates things, you can simply discard it and use the in-game expansion manager and everything will work as before.


Regarding the folders
C:\Oolite\AddOns
C:\Oolite\ManagedAddOns
C:\Oolite\DeactivatedAddOns
C:\Oolite\ManagedDeactivatedAddOns:

The first one is the standard expansions folder that has been there since the first versions of Oolite. Not much to say about it, we all pretty much know what it is for.

The second one is a big mystery to me. No idea whatsoever why Oolite Starter tries to use it. Managed addons are meant to be internally handled by the game and Starter should show nothing about them to the end user, except maybe a list of which ones are installed. The user was never meant to have to worry about Managed AddOns - that's why the default managed addons folder is buried deep inside the game's folder tree structure, it is the in-game's expansion manager's job to work with them and the user is only providing decisions on what to install, remove etc. via the Manager's interface. The fact that Starter exposes the managed addons structure to the user expecting them to manage expansions instead of Oolite itself (and pointing to a wrong default folder to boot) is not OK and I can see why people get really confused about it.

The third one is probably OK for moving expansions that you don't want to run in the game but also don't want to delete and have to redownload later.

The fourth one is a consequences of trying to manage addons that should normally be managed only by the game itself. Again, should probably not exist, it is confusing.


Now, regarding the restricted system causing hyperspace failure, yes it is an OXP that causes it and the OXP works as intended. The underlying issue here is that you may have made the mistake that is very common these days: downloaded a bunch of expansions in one go and suddenly the game does not do what you would expect. Did you use any of the flavor OXPs that are out there? Pro-tip: don't use them. Flavor OXPs are just collections of expansions that someone thought might be cool to group together. Regardless of good intentions and all, they are just the opinions of some guys and those opinions may or may not coincide with what you want in the game. Every person has their own preferences and OXPs that I like may be the same OXPs that you dislike, so why would you download my flavor OXP and not find what you want yourself instead? The best way to use expansions is to have a general idea of what you want to have in your game and go look for OXPs that more or less do what you want yourself. Then install them one by one, confirm that they indeed do what you envisioned, discard the ones that make unwanted changes to your game (like the restricted systems one; it would have been easy to know which one it is because you would have noticed the hyperspace issue right after installing it, now you don't know which one it is because it was installed together with a pile of other expansions in one go).


It is unfortunate that you are encountering such issues. From what I gather from this thread, Oolite Starter seems to have some problems under Windows. It is probably fine for Linux and Mac but if people on Windows (oh and btw there is absolutely nothing wrong with using Windows) are getting confused, then we need a bug fix version of the Starter for Windows asap. I am concerned that if two persons had the same exact issue, then there might have been another two hundred persons who had it as well but did not bother to come here to report it, they just gave up on the game altogether. And that would be a pity.

[Gargery]

Many thanks another_commander, your reply is informative and helpful. I hope your thorough explanation benefits other users too

Yes, you are right in your assumption: following your previous advice about directory structures I tried the Starter again and downloaded one of the Flavours as a shortcut to somewhere close to what I had last time. I concur with your opinion that this was probably a mistake.

The current Oolite is considerably tougher to play than the original Elite for the BBC micro in the 1980s - forty years ago so I'm giving my age away. The graphics are much nicer, but the original was a real masterpiece of coding.

[hiran]

There is some explanation about the four folders for expansion management available:
https://github.com/OoliteProject/Oolite ... management

The reason for that came up as most users expected to be able to seamlessly switch between the in game expansion manager and OoliteStarter. Yet expansions should be deactivated such that they still are on your computer and do not require to be re-downloaded. When the UI was simplified there were no more buttons to activate and deactivate.

Indeed the screenshots all show Linux. Oolite's directory structure is different across the different operating systems.

If the flavors have problems they may be modified. If they just introduce a different behaviour they may be documented. After all they are meant to tweak the game in one or the other direction.

And wichever way you use to find you combination of expansions - you can save that as your expansion set. Even when you save a game OoliteStarter does keep track and can warn you if the expansions you have are not the same as when you played last time.

So OoliteStarter tries to help juggling expansions - but it cannot guarantee that some set of expansions do not break the game.

[greg]

I joined purely for this thread. I might stick around, I've been playing Oolite for what seems like decades

oolite.oxp.redspear.alien_systems:0.2

oolite.oxp.redspear.alien_systems.oxz\Scripts\alien_systems.js

Find the line:
_alienVisa = 0; // set jump restrictions
change it to:
_alienVisa = 1; // set jump restrictions

Save the file and re-add it to the archive.

[Cholmondely]

I joined purely for this thread. I might stick around, I've been playing Oolite for what seems like decades

Welcome to the merry throng! Here's hoping that you do stick around!

What got you into Oolite? 1984's Elite? Frontier? Or something else?