*** It's Here OXP MIRROR ***

[Vaztr]

Your right - the links are screwed - missing the capital o

The site has been removed because of the 'legal ramifications' although I did laugh to myself at this because ALL OXPs on BOX and MEDIAFIRE have ads on them!

Maybe we should stop using their services as well!

Geez

[Cmd. Cheyd]

... because ALL OXPs on BOX and MEDIAFIRE have ads on them!

Maybe we should stop using their services as well!

I am the only one, to my knowledge, to ask you to remove an OXP due to legal ramifications, and I use neither Box nor Mediafire sir.

[Thargoid]

Umm, Box.net doesn't have ads, at least that I see when I've downloaded OXPs people have hosted there?

[Vaztr]

@Cmd Cheyd

Point taken that you host your own files - That's great

Smivs post was the one I was referring to.

Thargoid - when you next go to a BOX download page, have a look at the text along the bottom of the screen - you'll see something along the lines of...

Want Box for your Business? Call 1-877-729-4269

An ad perhaps? Or maybe they do this for free? I wouldn't know, but then again you wouldn't know if staying at A L'AISE was free or not from the ad it displays on the front page at www.alaise.com.au

This is all just getting too hard

[Smivs]

@Vaztr
My post seems to have 'got to you' a bit, for which I'm sorry. I didn't mean to sound harsh.

Personally, I have no objection to you mirroring mine, provided the link goes directly to a download (and not via a 'commercial' page) and that it is ad-free.
The one I've checked so far (Boa Clipper) seems to link to your Homepage!

I think this is quite reasonable. The box.net download is just a download page with contact info for box.net at the bottom. I don't see this as an ad, so much as a resource for visitors who have clicked through directly to the download to allow them to learn about box.net's services.
Unfortunately I don't know how yours works because I got through to your homepage. As I said I'm happy to have my OXPs mirrored, "provided the link goes directly to a download (and not via a 'commercial' page) and that it is ad-free."

By the way, I don't have any problem with the concept of a 'Commercial Internet'. I actually operate a commercial website myself, although my personal site (where I host my OXPs) has been proudly ad free since it's birth.

[Vaztr]

You're right Smivs it did.

The box.net download is just a download page with contact info for box.net at the bottom. I don't see this as an ad, so much as a resource for visitors who have clicked through directly to the download to allow them to learn about box.net's services.

This didn't help me either - mines an ad theirs is a
'resource for visitors... ...to allow them to learn about box.net's services' - that's an Ad.

Oxford english dictionary - 'a notice or announcement in a public medium promoting a product, service , or event or publicizing a job vacancy'

I was only trying to provide a backup to a service that MOST members are already using that ADVERTISES, and for my efforts and the use of 800+Mb of my 'I pay for' web site, I thought a simple ad would be OK.

Obviously not.

I certainly didn't expect any congrats from anyone. But at the same time I didn't expect any complaints that are hypocritical.

Now lets see how many members object to their files being hosted BOX.NET now that they realise that BOX.NET advertises and tries to make money - rather than just hosting everyones files for free.

And I hope that you all have a fine old time trying to find a web host that will take the space and D/L hit for no charge and keep it free of 'resources for visitors... ...to allow them to learn about their services'

Really

This has all been a bit too hard

[SiriusCG]

Well, while you're at it, you should pull the ad out of your sig too.

Look at it this way, if folks were allowed to start posting ads for commercial sites, what's to stop someone from linking to a porn, warez or other questionable site? There are "under 18" users here and that can make it sticky for the board admins. Practically every fan board I've frequented has a "no commercial advertising" rule. Better to nip it in the bud.

If you really want to advertise your site, it's common courtesy to ask the board administrators if it's ok to do so BEFORE you do it.

Cheers.

[Vaztr]

Is everybody happy!

So I ask, when will youse all be deleting the files off BOX.NET and MEDIAFIRE

The words HYPOCRITCAL LEECHES spring to mind

And while I'm on my soap box - how many copyright infringements do we think exist in the OXPs out there? Have a look at the Your Ad Here ad sets and tell me that you are allowed to release ALL of those under ANY license other than that of the original copyright/patent owner.

[Cmd. Cheyd]

@Vaztr
I will attempt to keep a civil tongue... I do not care if you advertise you resort home through you sig as you were. It was short text with a single hyperlink. One of our other members already has an image-based signature that is an advertisement and naught has been said. In that regard, I support you.

However, I do take extreme offense at your characterization of myself and others as "Hypocritical Leeches". "In computing and specifically on the Internet, a leech or leecher is one who benefits, usually deliberately, from others' information or effort but does not offer anything in return, or makes only token offerings in an attempt to avoid being called a leech." No one asked you to mirror their OXPs to my knowledge. I know I certainly did not. Rather the contrary - You took MY OXPS and put them on a commercial site, and forced the individual browsing to view an ad to download them. You are LEECHING off my work, sir. You were going to use MY OXPS, without consent nor license, to generate income to pay for your website that advertises another one of your ventures in DIRECT VIOLATION of my expressed wishes. Were I so inclined, I could file suit against you.

I am not so inclined. I believe what you wished to do was a noble thing and were merely seeking to give back to a community you felt had given to you. Nor do I begrudge you your other efforts at capitalism. However, before you assume that a small advertisement is acceptable, you need to stop and realize it was not your decision to make. You are not the author/publisher. Had you asked, I'm sure many here would have given consent. I believe people are comfortable with Box/Mediafire because as the authors, that is how THEY elected to distribute their work. That act intrinsically grants approval for Box/Mediafire to profit (in some minuscule way) by their work. With communication and approval, they may well have been agreeable to grant you that same minimal recovery of cost. But you never gave them the opportunity to grant such...

I had other thoughts I wished to express, but it's late, and my brain wandered off about 10 minutes ago....

[Vaztr]

@Cmd Cheyd

I understand that you would be deeply insulted at my rant. It was not intended for you OR ANY OTHERS THAT HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO THE OOLITE COMMUNITY

It was aimed at those who believe that they should be able to take everything and then have a whinge about how hard done by they have been because while they are taking they had to view an ad - or had to view a link in a signature block.

Me - A Leech - sure I redirected users to my site while the requested file downloaded - but at no stage did I say that my site was the only site anyone could use. BOX and MEDIAFIRE are still there for everyones use. I mearly offered a backup for these - and even then people only needed to go there IF THEY WANTED TO

Humbug to all the leeches out there

[Smivs]

Vaztr,
There's no need to quote dictionaries at me...I know what an Ad is. I also know that box.net has a contact at the bottom of the download page (that could loosely be defined as an ad). What I don't know is what sort of ad your site would have shown when attempting to download one of my OXPs, because the link never went to a download, it went to your Homepage!
This whole sorry mess seems to have descended into insults and sarcasm since I went to bed last night, both things I can be very good at when I choose, and both things I firmly feel have no place on The Friendliest Board...etc, so I will say no more on this matter other to repeat my opinion that your idea for a mirror site was laudable in principle (if flawed in its application) and repeat my regrets that this has clearly upset you so much.

[another_commander]

Here is my point of view on this, for what it's worth.

I felt somewhat uneasy when Vaztr proposed the pop-up ad some time ago. Maybe I had a feeling it would come to this. The way I see it, Oolite and anything commercial don't mix well. Vaztr, if you would like to offer an alternative location for OXP downloads, that is great and I bet many people would be thankful, but the popup ad must go.

On the matter of commercial links in signatures, there are two members of this bulletin board that I can think of who use them (actually one, Vaztr already removed his link). In my opinion, this is not correct. I believe we should have mentioned it earlier, when the first sig of this type appeared, but if we accept our members to put their income generators as links in signatures, then maybe we should not be deleting spammers' posts with links to commercial sites too? I am not trying to force a policy, I am just saying that it is not right in my opinion and I would really appreciate it if we could see less of this phenomenon in the future.

Morevover, please try to keep the thread clean from generic or personal insults. It will be locked at the first hint of loss of control.

[DaddyHoggy]

<SNIP> how many copyright infringements do we think exist in the OXPs out there? Have a look at the Your Ad Here ad sets and tell me that you are allowed to release ALL of those under ANY license other than that of the original copyright/patent owner.

Potential breeches of (C) is discussed often on the forum and specifically, of every OXP that features something a bit "dodgy" (the Game itself in fact!) has always done what every fan game/fiction has ever done, zero-profit and love of the product (such as the Star Wars ships), as you make specific mention of the YAH OXP I'll say, as somebody who has contributed about 50 of the 300+ Ads in that particular OXP that parody is specifically allowed in many laws of many countries around the world and once again, none of the the "products" in the Ads are claiming to be the originals or trying to make any money from it. Dr. Nil who started the OXP specifically stated - NO REAL ADS for a real product would ever be allowed and we've stuck to that.

Now, can I suggest that normal service is resumed and this once again becomes the friendliest board this side of Riedquat (tm) (which would include changing your sig to something less nose-thumbing)

EDIT: Ninja'd by A_C, but I concur with his sentiments (with one caveat - the one other member I can think of who advertises in his sig - did come to the Forum first in outworld and specifically made that request - which nobody said no to at the time, and only then did the sig appear)

[Cody]

On the matter of commercial links in signatures... I am not trying to force a policy, I am just saying that it is not right in my opinion and I would really appreciate it if we could see less of this phenomenon in the future.

Actually, I think that this should be a definite policy... no commercial links.

[Darkbee]

In Vaztr's defense, the intention was already discussed in this thread and nobody batted an eye. I can see why Vaztr might be feeling a little ambushed after all the effort that has been put in.

There are lots of mixed messages here and it's easy to see why there would be confusion and some hard feelings. Essentially, it would seem the best course of action is to fumble around individually and just trust in the event of an "emergency" that the community will come together as a collective to avert disaster. All part of living in an imperfect world I suppose.

Chalk it up to experience and move on I guess.

----

Actually, I think that this should be a definite policy... no commercial links.

This isn't uncommon and I know of a couple of forums that police this in a very Draconian manner. In fact at PortableApps.com they don't allow links of any sort in your signature, even to personal websites. I think if you're going to enact some kind of policy like that, it needs to be clear, concise and universal.