Oolite Bulletins

I suggest to separate the cascade issue into the following partial questions:

* Should any entity with mass but not too much mass (main station upwards) cascade?

* Or, more restricted version, should anything that presumably contains enough quirium cascade? Then asteroids or cargo containers i.e. are out of the equation.

* Most restricted version: Only something with an active quirium reactor cascades - then derelicts for example are also out of the equation.

By answering those questions, what should be made to cascade an whatnot follows logically.

Vote and discuss.

A few follow on questions (see also original thread):

What is considered to have "enough" fuel? Do we mean ships, stations, missiles, or is there a further definition (ships which actually contain fuel? what about if the tank is empty).

What do you mean by an active reactor? Do stations have them?

What about Rock Hermits and similar?

Empty tank = no cascade? Difficult to implement, though.

I just voted for the "other option", but I really should have thought about it a bit more and voted for "Only something with an active quirium reactor cascades". I would argue that the definition for this is "a ship in open space".

Ships themselves don't use fuel to move through normal space. We know this, because we can fly around in-system forever without using fuel, and a total fuel leak doesn't leave us inert. Presumably, then, there is some other process which allows non-Newtonian flight. Missiles, however, do use fuel: when it runs out, they die. Otherwise they'd chase you forever, until you witched out.

Quirium can be used to distort spacetime. When it's expended in sufficient quantity through a witchdrive, it can punch a wormhole reaching up to 7 light-years. It's reasonable to assume, then, that it can also be used to create minor fluctuations – dents and dimples – in spacetime without being consumed, possibly as some form of Alcubierre drive. The Torus jumpdrive is this process operating at full capacity, moving you through real space at near lightspeed, and it can only work if local spacetime is sufficiently flat (i.e. not distorted by a large mass like a big station, a planet, a sun, or another active jumpdrive). If local spacetime is too distorted, you're left running around at a reduced speed.

A ship with an active in-system engine, regardless of the amount of witchfuel it has in its tanks, contains "active" quirium. Even if it's currently at speed 0, the engine, and the quirium it contains, is still active. Stations (main system stations, Con Stores, Hermits etc.) contain tanks of quirium in an inactive state. They also contain docked ships, which – since their drives are shut down – also contain inactive quirium. Derelicts, though, still contain active quirium: they've been damaged, and are pilotless, but the engine is still warm enough to be started by a salvage drone – therefore they should also cascade.

My interpretation would be: Q-bombs cause cascade explosions in active quirium only. Stations, fuel containers and docked ships contain only inactive quirium, so they don't cascade. Asteroids and other inert objects like cargo cannisters, of course, don't even enter the picture.

Technobabble: when science isn't good enough.

But independent (non-main) stations actually sell activated quirium, which, using its special expansive qualities, gives them free loading. It's also easy to send ships (illegally equipped to carry fuel in their cargo holds) to the sun, scoop some fuel, then return to the station and load it into the station's tanks without it losing its charge. It's marketed as being better for your ship than regular quirium, but I've seen some con stores that mix straight hydrogen into their quirium fuel. Main stations are required, due to their high traffic rate, to sell deactivated hydrogen, which is then pumped into the fuel intake (actually inside the fuel scoop on upgraded ships, present in a similar location on stock ships) and refined by the scooping system. So really, the stations are getting away with murder by selling you hydrogen for 2cr for 40 gallons! Activated quirium responds to Q-waves, but requires constant power running through it to keep it active. Otherwise, it reverts to plain hydrogen. Thus, fuel canisters do not cascade - they are unpowered and therefore contain just hydrogen. Derelict ships have auto-power-shutoff triggered by escape pod launch, and contain only hydrogen. A salvage drone can reinstate normal power flow, however it needs a "jump start" battery to activate the ship's quirium to reengage the reactor, which, of course, runs on activated star juice. That's why your ship has all sorts of protocols you have to go through before you power it down in the main station, it needs to make sure its fuel will be reactivated. That's also why only the GalCop-sanctioned, officially legal, main station is immune to Q-waves - but independent stations don't just explode, but even cascade. Even navy stations have been known to overlook this safety protocol, but due to their minesweeper satellites, they are safe. On large capital class cruisers, such as a Behemoth, there is no point in selling deactivated hydrogen as their main reactors and fuel supplies are already vulnerable. Note, though, that their sellable fuel supplies and their fuel tanks are separate - even Leviathans need to refuel after 7 ly.

wackyman465 wrote:

Technobabble: when science isn't good enough.

Yup... I think that's a very good point. The best thing to do would be to decide what cascade rules work best for gameplay, and then make up the explanation afterwards.

It depends on what you want Q-bombs to do. Are they simply anti-ship weapons (whose explosions will also damage bases, stations etc. without directly involving them in the cascade), or are they total weapons of mass destruction which envelop, and cascade, everything in their path? I'd prefer the former, I think: station-cascading just seems a bit too über for me. Plus, ships have the chance of fleeing: stations are just stuck there as sitting ducks.

Although, even if the cascade is restricted to active ships only, it's still a potentially fleet-killing e-bomb...

Disembodied wrote:

Although, even if the cascade is restricted to active ships only, it's still a potentially fleet-killing e-bomb...

Because of that, I had been thinking about implementing a high-tech (15 or higher) new piece of equipment for OSE that supresses the explosion of cascades including e-bombs for certain ships or in a certain radius around the device.

That would be quite logical, otherwise what for would the galactic navy and the thargoids even attack each other in battle formations?

My OSE device would be a bit like the minesweepers of LittleBear and Matt and be called "Quirium Chain Reaction Supressor". It could be acquired by player and NPC ships.

Perhaps that would be something up for discussion generally, if such a device makes sense or not or if yes, in what form.

I propose another choice...

Anything with Quirium in it can cascade, provided it is not too great a mass or too close to a large mass.

So, cargo containers of Quirium can cascade and all space stations can cascade and all ships can cascade when they have Quirium aboard.

I'm not sure what is easiest to program as a game parameter, but I feel all ships and stations should be vulnerable to the Q-Bomb.

I still don't understand how main station invulnerability fits into this, how it would be affected by a revised q-mine.
I also think the EQ solution might just make life too easy.

As per chapter one and three of Status Quo, I'm going for any old Quirum.

My interpretation was always:

<engage_technobabble>

'Quirium' itself is stable, but a Q-bomb makes use of an unstable 'isotope' of quirium discovered when trying to make a more efficient fuel injector. The initial cascade is deliberate excitation of a Quirium Isotope. However, when the resultant gravimetric shockwave hits 'normal' quirium, it is converted to the isotope and continues the cycle.

So stations, behemoths, other ships and any static fuel stores are cascade targets, unless properly shielded from gravimetric shockwaves. (Big stations and big ships should have adequate shields - but should take a pounding)

Asteroids, empty ships (basically anything with no quirium aboard) should be unaffected.

Moons upwards jam the Q-bombs gravitmetric pulse.

<disengage_technobabble>

Cheers,

Drew.

I have made some changes, which are consistent with the general flow of this discussion, but I have some issues with Rock Hermits killing me when they are destroyed, so I have not committed the changes yet.

There might be some modifications that come out as this continutes, but I think most people seem to have similar views.

Addendum to previous post....

Asteroids, and empty ships etc struck by a cascade should be destroyed, not unaffected. But they shouldn't trigger a subsequent cascade...

Cheers,

Drew.

ps. I know nothing about Physics.