UPDATED OXPS: Lave 1.70 & transports 2.45(new)

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phkb
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Re: UPDATED OXPS: Lave 1.70 & transports 2.45(new)

Post by phkb »

The benefit of putting all the PF2.0 code into Famous Planets means there’s fewer issues with conflicts and one centralised place to do everything. On the flip side, any OXP that adds planets or moons will need separate code anyway. My feeling is, system-specific OXPs should probably be in control of any system-specific functions, like PF2.0 integration. FPO should really only touch systems that don’t have a specific OXP, or only touch them when the system specific OXP isn’t installed. So, probably a bit of both will end up being the the answer, with FPO ceding control when the system OXP is present.
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Re: UPDATED OXPS: Lave 1.70 & transports 2.45(new)

Post by Cholmondely »

phkb wrote: Sun Apr 28, 2024 7:12 am
The benefit of putting all the PF2.0 code into Famous Planets means there’s fewer issues with conflicts and one centralised place to do everything. On the flip side, any OXP that adds planets or moons will need separate code anyway. My feeling is, system-specific OXPs should probably be in control of any system-specific functions, like PF2.0 integration. FPO should really only touch systems that don’t have a specific OXP, or only touch them when the system specific OXP isn’t installed. So, probably a bit of both will end up being the the answer, with FPO ceding control when the system OXP is present.
So bung the planetary locations into Famous Planets and bung the Bastan palace into Lave 2.0 ?

As an aside, Lave (Lore) claims: "Lave now has a total of six stations in orbit" (Selezen's wiki page based on Elite/Frontier).

I'm afraid that I posted Riredi before I saw your suggestion here.
Comments wanted:
Missing OXPs? What do you think is missing?
Lore: The economics of ship building How many built for Aronar?
Lore: The Space Traders Flight Training Manual: Cowell & MgRath Do you agree with Redspear?
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Re: UPDATED OXPS: Lave 1.70 & transports 2.45(new)

Post by phkb »

Cholmondely wrote: Sun Apr 28, 2024 7:30 am
So bung the planetary locations into Famous Planets and bung the Bastan palace into Lave 2.0 ?

As an aside, Lave (Lore) claims: "Lave now has a total of six stations in orbit" (Selezen's wiki page based on Elite/Frontier).

I'm afraid that I posted Riredi before I saw your suggestion here.
I'm busily adding all the locations into the individual OXP's as we speak, mainly because I have control over those ones at the moment. FPO isn't something I'm looking to get involved in at the moment, but I can compile all the changes I'm making into a script that could be included in FDO so it hands control to the system OXP's nicely.
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Re: Lave OXP

Post by Selezen »

Cholmondely wrote: Sat Apr 23, 2022 9:24 pm
Disembodied wrote: Sat Feb 23, 2008 4:16 pm
The Galactic Co-Operative means very little to the serfs tilling the fields of a Poor Agricultural Feudal planet, or the mind-numbed drones of an Industrial Dictatorship, or the Corporate wage-slaves. We, the pilots, are the lucky ones. We're out, and free: and, shameful to admit, we don't really care about the suffering billions toiling away at the bottom of all those gravity wells. A two-line description tells us all we want to know about them, their planets and their lives.
1) Interraction with Diplomancy. Should graduates of Lave Academy be given (say) a year's visa for Lave on graduation?
2) HIMSN is not based at Lave. But maybe some sort of office at the Academy for "recruiting" students if they have a sufficient Elite ranking?
3) Recruiting offices for Galactic Navy, RRS Group, Taxi Galactica (are there any others of relevance?).
Some thoughts on the above.

The initial quite from Disembodied is crucial to what I feel is the core of the Ooniverse. That massive gap between the planetary societies and the spacefaring community. I think most worlds are probably unaware that there is a functional space society miling about above their heads. I think GalCop has used their systems for strategic and economic reasons to allow interstellar trade to flourish but hasn't bothered to let the more technoologically challenged worlds even know they are there. That's why GalCop lists members by world name rather than system name. TL10+ worlds are probably aware that GalCop exists and there are likely treaties between them that grease the wheels. Which brings me to...

1) Should graduates of Lave Academy be given a visa for Lave? No. Canon fiction (Dark Wheel, I think) states that it's very rare for spacefarers to be allowed planetside. And this makes sense to me given the economic and biological impact. Quarantine would be a necessity, and any potential biogens would need to be strongly filtered out. I imagine the process of trying to get access to a planet you weren't born on being 20 times worse than Australian Border Control.
2) Her Imperial Majesty's Space Navy - jeeez, those guys. This opens up a few theories I've had for probably about thirty years on the structure of GalCop and the member worlds. First, GalCop basically has no jurisdiction planetside - worlds govern themselves and are left to their own devices. That's why there's a label for each political type of world and not a blanket "GalCop Planetary Governance" status. As such, and with the first point in mind, HIMSN and the galactic navy are two entirely separate entities. I don't think HIMSN would be based on a GalCop station - I doubt they would have a presence due to the aforementioned potential risk of contagion. Also, Lave is a "dictatorship" run by "the tyrant" and if that name is earned rather than granted then I think there would be a strong independent vein running through LaveGov. As such I think any HIMSN presence in Lave orbitspace would be in a separate and secure facility. I have a LOT more of this stuff bouncing around in my brain...

Anyway, just some thoughts. It's been a while since I let me mind wander through Elite/Oolite lore so thanks for indulging me. :)
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Re: UPDATED OXPS: Lave 1.70 & transports 2.45(new)

Post by phkb »

Selezen wrote: Sun May 19, 2024 12:57 am
That massive gap between the planetary societies and the spacefaring community. I think most worlds are probably unaware that there is a functional space society miling about above their heads.
How to you see the issue of the TL of the station being linked to the planet? With a (say) TL2 Av.Ag. world, why would the station be linked technologically with the planet if most worlds are unaware of the spacefaring community, and there is a massive gap between the planet and space communities?
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Re: UPDATED OXPS: Lave 1.70 & transports 2.45(new)

Post by Selezen »

Yeah, that's a big plot hole right there. No answer to that one, sorry.

If I was to make something up on the hoof, I'd say potentially there could be a clandestine link to the planetary economy. Unmanned drones could be doing naughty things in remote places to ferry goods to the station?

Alternatively GalCop controls the economy of those stations to deliberately affect supply and demand and balance the galactic economy. Another reason why the Federation and Imperials don't like them...
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Re: Lave OXP

Post by Cholmondely »

Selezen wrote: Sun May 19, 2024 12:57 am
Some thoughts on the above.

The initial quite from Disembodied is crucial to what I feel is the core of the Ooniverse. That massive gap between the planetary societies and the spacefaring community. I think most worlds are probably unaware that there is a functional space society milling about above their heads. I think GalCop has used their systems for strategic and economic reasons to allow interstellar trade to flourish but hasn't bothered to let the more technologically challenged worlds even know they are there. That's why GalCop lists members by world name rather than system name. TL10+ worlds are probably aware that GalCop exists and there are likely treaties between them that grease the wheels. Which brings me to...

1) Should graduates of Lave Academy be given a visa for Lave? No. Canon fiction (Dark Wheel, I think) states that it's very rare for spacefarers to be allowed planetside. And this makes sense to me given the economic and biological impact. Quarantine would be a necessity, and any potential biogens would need to be strongly filtered out. I imagine the process of trying to get access to a planet you weren't born on being 20 times worse than Australian Border Control.
2) Her Imperial Majesty's Space Navy - jeeez, those guys. This opens up a few theories I've had for probably about thirty years on the structure of GalCop and the member worlds. First, GalCop basically has no jurisdiction planetside - worlds govern themselves and are left to their own devices. That's why there's a label for each political type of world and not a blanket "GalCop Planetary Governance" status. As such, and with the first point in mind, HIMSN and the galactic navy are two entirely separate entities. I don't think HIMSN would be based on a GalCop station - I doubt they would have a presence due to the aforementioned potential risk of contagion. Also, Lave is a "dictatorship" run by "the tyrant" and if that name is earned rather than granted then I think there would be a strong independent vein running through LaveGov. As such I think any HIMSN presence in Lave orbitspace would be in a separate and secure facility. I have a LOT more of this stuff bouncing around in my brain...

Anyway, just some thoughts. It's been a while since I let me mind wander through Elite/Oolite lore so thanks for indulging me. :)
More thoughts on the above...

1) Diplomancy OXP.

This is not quite the same as Phantorgorth's 2009 thinking about a Visa OXP (which grew out of Frontier's Van Maanen's visas).

Commander Day's Diplomancy, if I recall correctly, came about as an attempt to tax your excess wealth by your home system. It then grew to include the ability to manage wars ... and to charge for visas to visit systems. It applies not so much to landing on-planet (I've not tried!) as to visiting the GalCop main orbitals, system stations (eg SLAPUs or Imperial Astrofactories) and visiting liners (which obey the system's laws). I'm a tad unsure about how it relates to each of the various varieties of rock hermits (mining/chaotic/coves) found in the various systems.

It could be a vital ingredient towards the creation of a dynamic ooniverse - or helping manage the conflict between a nascent Federation, Empire and Alliance. See Resources for people writing naval wars .oxp's

PG's Visa OXP would inter-alia issue separate visas for Planetfall.


Reference:
PhantorGorth wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:33 pm
...

It will be written as a Visa engine and then an OXP can be written to add the Visa to the Ooniverse. It will support System Visas, Planet Visits Visas (will require a minor modification to Planetfall) and Station/Ship Permits. Visas will appear as equipment. OXP developers will be able to specify the visa expiry, availability, eligibility criteria, sanctions and obviously purchase price (administrative charge :) ).

It is currently at the detailed planning stage at the moment.


2) HIMSN

The lore which Disembodied and Cody/EV developed for the HIMSN OXP makes it something quite different from your lore on the subject. It was only partially incorporated into the published alpha-stage oxp.

References:
1) Her Imperial Majesty's Space Navy (HIMSN) is the military arm of the Tetiri Conclave, founded at the time of the first Thargoid attacks. The success of HIMSN led to the previously isolated Conclave being invited to join the Co-operative, and it is now one of the larger and more cohesive political subgroups to be found anywhere within the eight.

Although the Tetiri Conclave only recently became a full voting member, the ships and crews of HIMSN are already at the forefront of the fight against Thargoid incursions across the entire Co-operative volume. Unlike the disparate forces of GalCop, which tend to be focused on planetary policing, much of the work of HIMSN is carried out in deep space, denying territory to the enemy and thwarting raiding parties before they reach inhabited systems. Now that HIMSN has the financial and industrial muscle of the whole Co-operative to call upon, we can anticipate the swift and total defeat of the Thargoid menace.

There are a handful of bases dotted around other galaxies, but this is the main focus of Her Imperial Majesty's Space Navy.


2) The Tetiri are physically large - hippo-sized or larger, potentially biologically immortal, and matriarchal (in fact, only the females are sentient: the males are mouse-sized, mouse-brained, and essentially just testicles on legs: they attach themselves parasitically to females, in a manner akin to some angler fish, and slowly dissolve (see https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/bizarre-love-life-of-the-anglerfish.html). The Tetiri culture operates on a principal of esteem: adult females who attract admiration from their peer group don't age, physically. Esteem can be gained from artistic endeavour, or science, or general "wisdom". The Empress - the most esteemed female on Tetiri - is several dozen centuries old, and showing no sign of slowing down.

They're technically a Corporate State - this is the closest classification to Tetiri's hierarchical but fluid meritocracy.
Comments wanted:
Missing OXPs? What do you think is missing?
Lore: The economics of ship building How many built for Aronar?
Lore: The Space Traders Flight Training Manual: Cowell & MgRath Do you agree with Redspear?
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