Oolite Bulletins

Cowell & MgRath have been building their Cobra Mk.3 ships at Lave for over half a century.


But the planet is a rich agricultural with a TL of 5!



If they are made at the Coriolis station, the TL is too low to even service them ("Maintenance")! How can it hope to make them?

If they are made down on the planet, surely the same applies. And PlanetFall OXP requires a TL of 9 to sell the equipment for landing/take off.


This information comes from Holdstock's imaginative "The Space Traders Flight Training Manual" from the OBSERVER'S GUIDE
TO SHIPS IN SERVICE section at the back. It is missing from B&B's original unfinished manual.


Any ideas?

The one which came to my mind was based on the crumbling of GalCop - that Lave used to have a better TL back in the Golden Age, but being clobbered by the Thargoids - and then the pirates - lost it.

But that still leaves the problem of how they can make the spaceships today - and get them into space from the planet. And why one can't do maintenance there, even on a Cobra Mk.3...


(There are similar issues with a number of the other ships - eg Faulcon de Lacy of Reorte TL6, Poor Agricultural: Vipers, Sidewinders...)



References:
http://www.elitehomepage.org/manual.htm - Holdstock's Space Traders Flight Training Manual
http://www.elitehomepage.org/playguide.htm#A0 - B&B's Elite Player's Guide (see Captions for Screen Dumps)
https://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/Cowell_%26_MgRath - Our wiki page on Cowell & MgRath - and see the link to Faulcon deLacy (this all seems to jibe with the FFE lore website https://www.jades.org/whoswho.htm)

perhaps the Tech Level is a general/averaged rating? after all things vary even in countries - China or India for example, there's huge areas of absolute poverty and there are areas of high tech production. C&M might have high-tech production plants based in low tech areas for the cheap labour costs or such? not suggesting they're a sweat shop company though, in case their lawyers are reading

Cholmondely wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 11:33 pm

This information comes from Holdstock's imaginative "The Space Traders Flight Training Manual" from the OBSERVER'S GUIDE
TO SHIPS IN SERVICE section at the back. It is missing from B&B's original unfinished manual.


Any ideas?

Holdstock added some really fun stuff IMHO but then there were also oddities like this one.

I have attemped to answer this before.

• Nutshell -
  • tech level relateds to planet rather than station
  • all stations have a tech of at least 10 as a result of standardisation
  • wealth determines ships available (Lave is a rich agricultural)
  • planet tech determines equipment available (more demand than for ships)

This would work for Lave but not so well for Reorte (mamba).

Redspear wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 12:45 pm

I have attempted to answer this before.

• Nutshell -
  • tech level related to planet rather than station
  • all stations have a tech of at least 10 as a result of standardisation
  • wealth determines ships available (Lave is a rich agricultural)
  • planet tech determines equipment available (more demand than for ships)

This would work for rich Lave but not so well for poor Reorte (mamba).

Thank you for the (sadly) needed reminder. Your solution meets some of the criticism.

But I rather think my point about Maintenance still stands.

And, looking at the older thread, I see a major disjunction between the player's Ooniverse and the Lore over Maintenance.

I can see at least two possible OXP solutions which would help:

1) Making Maintenance possible for ships made on that system at the Main Orbital Station or down on the planet (and it should be at a good high level, TL15 or such - as good as new!). And extending that level of service to ships from the higher non-TL15 systems.

2) Having new stations at Lave, Reorte etc which are shipbuilding stations. And where the necessary maintenance can be done on those locally manufactured ships. There might also be minor discounts on certain items of equipment just for those ships.

The problem with this second solution is of course the horrendous amount of work involved in building these stations. We now have several in the game as OXPs:
1) Taranis at G1 Lerelace - this looks fine thanks to Phkb, but only manufactures two ships - the Navy Frigate and the Outrider. And the Navy Frigate will be serviced by the Navy.
2) Isis Interstellar (Killer Wolf)
3) Aquarian Shipbuilding Corp. HQ (Thargoid)
4) Mandotech Shipyard (looks clunky, alas)
5) The various stations in G7's The Assassins' Guild OXP (look worse than clunky).

and I suppose that the Coluber Main Orbital Station at Riredi also counts.

Nothing for any of the Big 4. And nothing for GalSec at Vetitice.


Reference: LittleBear's comprehensive list of manufacturers

Cholmondely wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 2:51 pm

But I rather think my point about Maintenance still stands.

Key question here is, where is the shipyard?

If it's on the planet then we're left with the original tech level problem (or it's a pawn of the dictatorship itself).

If it's on the station then we have the maintenance problem (or we could reduce its requirements - which might be reasonable if you follow my all stations are effectively TL10).

If it's on some other orbital facility then that would make a lot of sense but is yet to appear in the game.
Back in elite days one could excuse not finding it round such a large planet but in oolite it should be fairly obvious.