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Rocks in 1.90/91

https://bb.oolite.space/viewtopic.php?t=21408

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Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 4:15 am
by phkb
This may be just me, and something specific to my rig, but I thought it would be worth getting others opinions before I go changing anything.

Since all the new light and material changes were put into 1.90, rock hermits, asteroids, boulders and splinters seem a bit too "bright". This screenshot tells the story (top row is a rock hermit and asteroid, bottom row is boulder and splinter)
Image

I think they should be closer to this:
Image

What do others think? Are you seeing the same effect on your machines?

If you want to play around with the changes I'm suggesting, you can take this code and put it into a "shipdata-overrides.plist" file:

Code: Select all

{
	"oolite_template_asteroid" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_asteroid_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_asteroid_alt" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_alt_asteroid_diffuse.png" =	{
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_boulder" = {
		materials =	{
			"oolite_boulder_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_boulder_alt" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_alt_boulder_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_splinter" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_splinter_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_rock-hermit" = {
		materials = { 
			"oolite_rock_hermit_diffuse.png" = { 
				gloss = 0.4;
				diffuse_color = (0.4, 0.4, 0.4, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
				emission_map = 
				{
					name = "oolite_rock_hermit_diffuse.png";
					extract_channel = "a";
				};
				emission_modulate_color = (0.9520, 0.9630, 0.8824); 
			}; 
		};
	};
	"oolite_rock_hermit_rock" = {
		materials = { 
			"oolite_rock_hermit_rock_diffuse.png" = { 
				gloss = 0.4;
				diffuse_color = (0.4, 0.4, 0.4, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0);
			}; 
		};	
	};	
}

Re: Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 4:28 am
by phkb
I should add, all the above was done in a vanilla install of 1.91. Also, I don’t presume to fully understand the materials system, so those with more understanding feel free to chime in with corrected values!

Re: Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 5:14 am
by another_commander
In most pictures of real asteroids I've seen they appear bright, but probably not as glossy as the current ones do. Maybe lowering the gloss value a bit would suffice.

Also, specular color should never be completely black. See Everything is Shiny by John Hable, the guy who created the infamous Uncharted 2 tonemapper. Instead of pure black (0.0), the value 0.04 should be used instead for absolute minimum specular.

Not exactly related to asteroids, but I was also thinking that maybe it is time we update the entire default shipset? Maybe get the 1.88 spec/gloss ships incorporated as standard? Yes/No/Maybe?

Re: Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 6:32 am
by phkb
Here's some other variations:

Image
shipdata-overrides.plist

Code: Select all

{
	"oolite_template_asteroid" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_asteroid_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.2;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_asteroid_alt" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_alt_asteroid_diffuse.png" =	{
				gloss = 0.2;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_boulder" = {
		materials =	{
			"oolite_boulder_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.2;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_boulder_alt" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_alt_boulder_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.2;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_splinter" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_splinter_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.2;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_rock-hermit" = {
		materials = { 
			"oolite_rock_hermit_diffuse.png" = { 
				gloss = 0.4;
				diffuse_color = (0.4, 0.4, 0.4, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
				emission_map = 
				{
					name = "oolite_rock_hermit_diffuse.png";
					extract_channel = "a";
				};
				emission_modulate_color = (0.9520, 0.9630, 0.8824); 
			}; 
		};
	};
	"oolite_rock_hermit_rock" = {
		materials = { 
			"oolite_rock_hermit_rock_diffuse.png" = { 
				gloss = 0.4;
				diffuse_color = (0.4, 0.4, 0.4, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			}; 
		};	
	};	
}
Image
shipdata-overrides.plist

Code: Select all

{
	"oolite_template_asteroid" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_asteroid_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_asteroid_alt" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_alt_asteroid_diffuse.png" =	{
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_boulder" = {
		materials =	{
			"oolite_boulder_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_boulder_alt" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_alt_boulder_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_splinter" = {
		materials = {
			"oolite_splinter_diffuse.png" = {
				gloss = 0.1;
				diffuse_color = (0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			};
		};
	};
	"oolite_template_rock-hermit" = {
		materials = { 
			"oolite_rock_hermit_diffuse.png" = { 
				gloss = 0.3;
				diffuse_color = (0.4, 0.4, 0.4, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
				emission_map = 
				{
					name = "oolite_rock_hermit_diffuse.png";
					extract_channel = "a";
				};
				emission_modulate_color = (0.9520, 0.9630, 0.8824); 
			}; 
		};
	};
	"oolite_rock_hermit_rock" = {
		materials = { 
			"oolite_rock_hermit_rock_diffuse.png" = { 
				gloss = 0.3;
				diffuse_color = (0.4, 0.4, 0.4, 1.0);
				specular_color = (0.04, 0.04, 0.04, 1.0);
			}; 
		};	
	};	
}
As for pushing the 1.88 spec/gloss ships into master, just confirming, that's the "Oolite v1.88 Base Shipset Normal and Specular/Gloss Maps" OXP, correct? If so, I'm all for it. They look incredible, and would seriously lift the looks of a base install. And we'd only be doubling the size of the install package. :)

Re: Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 8:43 am
by Cholmondely
I vote for including the "Normal and Specular+Gloss Maps for Oolite v1.88"+ in the Vanilla game code.

The oxp name is just too confusing for dumb pilots such as myself, and it would be much better to include it in the game download. Somebody would need to add a note about the oxp in the Expansions Manager blurb, though (to say that it was included from v.1.92 onwards).


Phkb: thank you for this thread. I'd never noticed the change from v.1.88!

Re: Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 9:10 am
by another_commander
For reference, this is a sample of what rock hermits and asteroids look like in the shipset that is proposed for inclusion in the core (boulders and splinters are not included in the shipset, at least not yet):

Image

The specularity is controlled by the shipset's specular maps so there is no need to have a specular_color defined. There is also an alternative asteroid, which is this one:

Image

Edit: Meh, could have probably gotten better shots, but you get the idea.

Re: Rocks in 1.90/91

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:44 pm
by Redspear
phkb wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 4:15 am
Image
another_commander wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 9:10 am
Image
These make great comparison shots.

With the topmost rock hermit, we can see a 'crease' (top right point of the hexagon) that is much more subtle in the second image. Likewise there is a glare on the asteroid that obscures detail while the second image is relatively glare free.
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