Oolite Bulletins

A suggestion I had made in another thread, I just thought it would be interesting if it was discussed in an OXP suggestion of its own:
Another suggestion to create a more changing envirorment would be placing a tax. This could vary according to the system. For example, Corporate (safer) systems would have a higher tax, whereas less safe systems would have a lower tax. This could be payed upon entering a station, and it could be based on the ship and/or the value of goods that the cargo has.
Such an oxp could change many things, since the player would have to calculate the intermediate stops he would make (if any, the extra fuel tanks could be very helpful here), as well as the net profit from the sale he would eventually make.
It would also be very profitable (even more so than it is now) to go and sell goods in anarchies (perhaps no tax would be imposed there), but one would not net a good profit trading from one corporate world to another.
It could be based on the immediate (upon docking) confiscation of illegal goods, ie the player would pay upon docing with the coriolis/ dodecahedron station.
There is of course the issue of what would happen if the player was unable (due to lack of cash) to make the payment. Perhaps confiscation of part of the cargo?

There are two facts in life

1- You pay taxes,
2- You die.

Well you can get killed easily on oolite so why not pay taxes .

What the heck is so fun about being taxed??

Are we making a game for accountants that get all hot about spreadsheets and taxcodes? Is filing paperwork in triplicate something of a turn on for anyone who normally plays oolite?

Taxes are already included in the price of goods at stations.

K.I.S.S.

...and fun!

Now if you want to make some missions where you get to go hunt down and butcher some raving lunatic tax collector that has it in for you and causes trouble for you wherever you go, then Bravo! to you good sir.<standing ovation>. That would be a useful and thoroughly enjoyable oxp. Maybe it could apply to all beuracrats and public officials of one sort or another where occasionally one makes trouble for you over and above the call of duty and you have a mission you can take to silence him and stop the abuse. Or maybe a la' Robin Hood you could go around finding people being oppressed and "take care of it" for them, with interesting twists and turns as you attempt to track down the individuals, and silencing them might not mean "killing them" but finding dirt and blackmailing them, obtaining evidence and reporting to the proper authorities, etc. Might chase back and forth across half the galaxy a few times to accomplish such a mission.

That would be FUN!!!

I also don't think that we need an OXP that makes life harder for the ordinary trader very urgently. Simple trading is what almost every player has to do in the very beginning of the game, when his net worth increases slowly enough already, and he still has to buy so much equipment. This is the phase of the game where a tax would punish the player most. In short: a tax would mostly serve to make the already-very-slow progression in the beginning even slower. The only purpose that would serve is to make the initial frustration for new players even bigger. I don't think we need that.

Commander McLane wrote:

I also don't think that we need an OXP that makes life harder for the ordinary trader very urgently.

I tend to agree ... while I can see the benefit in adding a layer of complexity to the economic geography of the game, I don't think Oolite's economic model as it stands – both the economics of interplanetary trade in general, and the economics of player/ship development – is up to the job. This is really something that could come into play in an Oolite 2.0, with high-tax (but relatively safe) inner worlds, where the beginning player can pootle about in an Adder and learn the ropes, and make just enough money to think about maybe upgrading to a Moray and start exploring the more rambunctious, risky and lower-tax systems further out ... and so on: all of which would require not just a hand-crafted set of core systems but a total overhaul of ship prices, equipment upgrades, trade opportunities, mini-missions, and more. In such a game, the burden of tax and central authority could be one incentive to get players to move on out and go exploring the wild frontier: but in Oolite as it stands, I think this would just cause unnecessary hardship for beginners doing milk runs.

Commander McLane wrote:

I also don't think that we need an OXP that makes life harder for the ordinary trader very urgently. Simple trading is what almost every player has to do in the very beginning of the game, when his net worth increases slowly enough already, and he still has to buy so much equipment. This is the phase of the game where a tax would punish the player most. In short: a tax would mostly serve to make the already-very-slow progression in the beginning even slower. The only purpose that would serve is to make the initial frustration for new players even bigger. I don't think we need that.

Tax free threshold for the Harmless , tax brackets increasing so the Dangerous --> Elite are burdened by it only. ?

If anyone were to look at writing a tax.oxp, I would suggest that it's done in the form of docking fees where, for immersion reasons, the games tells you a little bit more about what it.

Crude examples
"A docking fee and tax of 320Cr, amounting to 10% of the value of your current cargo, has been deducted from your account. Remember that taxes are what keeps the lanes safe."
"A docking fee and tax of 64Cr, amounting to 2% of the value of your current cargo, has been deducted from your account. Thank you for supporting the local entrepreneurs."

I do think this it would be better to implement something like this if the Oolite economic system is given a major overhaul though.

Personally, I play games for escapism. I won't be downloading Getting-Diseases.OXP, Death-From-Old-Age.OXP or Tax.OXP. I can't see the fun in it.

Especially since:
- we are trading needed goods between systems at our risk for their benefit - do they want a Ooniversal trader strike?
- we are the ones taking the life-or-death risks to get their shoddy 6 Credits per tonne of Toxic Weeviloid Belly Steaks on their plates - do they want their food supplies to stop?
- we are the ones expected to support GalCop and help save humanity from the Thargoid threat for no pay other than the standard bounty - don't they want our protection?

No taxation without representation!

Trader taxation is regressive taxation.

Wat Tyler didn't pay docking fees - and neither will we!

You want tax from me? Come and get it, and good luck when you get within 15 km of my lasers.

Exerpt from the original Elite manual section Intergalactic Trading:

Most space stations have made the process of trading very simple, in order to facilitate a fast turnover in goods and ships, import and export tarriffs - which are high on some worlds - are automatically added or deducted and this is reflected in the prices shown.

We are already being taxed, it's already in the price.

CommonSenseOTB wrote:

Exerpt from the original Elite manual section Intergalactic Trading:

Most space stations have made the process of trading very simple, in order to facilitate a fast turnover in goods and ships, import and export tarriffs - which are high on some worlds - are automatically added or deducted and this is reflected in the prices shown.

We are already being taxed, it's already in the price.

That's what I always assumed.

You want to get really clever, log every transaction someone makes over the course of a year and then once a year, pop up a tax demand on entering a station.
Tells you to pay it. You could refuse and then you have a chance of getting attacked by a band of Tax Office ships. I can imagine these becoming shoot on sight ships.
Also, seeing as being in the tax service would be fairly dangerous, they would employ the best pilots, giving you missions to run for the tax office.
These missions would of course make you extremely unpopular with everyone.

I feel a fiction idea coming on...

This could then extend to an OXP for all those annoyances in life, like say traffic wardens, speed cameras, and such.
I imagine though that this would just give you more things to kill without regard. I quite fancy blasting the traffic wardens ships and speed cameras.

!m!

maaarcooose wrote:

This could then extend to an OXP for all those annoyances in life, like say traffic wardens, speed cameras, and such.

Oh, gawd. All the appeal of an Elite life has just gone away for me. Traffic Wardens are there to fine you for not keeping in the space lanes, aren't they?

All I need now is Back-Seat-Pilot.OXP ("You're going too fast", "scoop that cargo", "watch out for that Python", "This ship's filthy", "I don't know why I bother", "I always said you were no good") and I'll set the controls for the heart of the sun.

SandJ wrote:

maaarcooose wrote:

This could then extend to an OXP for all those annoyances in life, like say traffic wardens, speed cameras, and such.

Oh, gawd. All the appeal of an Elite life has just gone away for me. Traffic Wardens are there to fine you for not keeping in the space lanes, aren't they?

Or 'parking' somewhere you shouldn't like in front of the station.

!m!

maaarcooose wrote:

You want to get really clever, log every transaction someone makes over the course of a year and then once a year, pop up a tax demand on entering a station.
Tells you to pay it. You could refuse and then you have a chance of getting attacked by a band of Tax Office ships. I can imagine these becoming shoot on sight ships.
Also, seeing as being in the tax service would be fairly dangerous, they would employ the best pilots, giving you missions to run for the tax office.
These missions would of course make you extremely unpopular with everyone.

I feel a fiction idea coming on...

This could then extend to an OXP for all those annoyances in life, like say traffic wardens, speed cameras, and such.
I imagine though that this would just give you more things to kill without regard. I quite fancy blasting the traffic wardens ships and speed cameras.

!m!

Don't forget you also have to pay for all the tax collector ships you destroy as well.

SandJ wrote:

Oh, gawd. All the appeal of an Elite life has just gone away for me. Traffic Wardens are there to fine you for not keeping in the space lanes, aren't they?

All I need now is Back-Seat-Pilot.OXP ("You're going too fast", "scoop that cargo", "watch out for that Python", "This ship's filthy", "I don't know why I bother", "I always said you were no good") and I'll set the controls for the heart of the sun.

SandJ Harcourt Fenton Mudd:

http://youtu.be/Ag1EbxYKh_4

She'd make a scary tax collector!

maaarcooose wrote:

CommonSenseOTB wrote:

Exerpt from the original Elite manual section Intergalactic Trading:

Most space stations have made the process of trading very simple, in order to facilitate a fast turnover in goods and ships, import and export tarriffs - which are high on some worlds - are automatically added or deducted and this is reflected in the prices shown.

We are already being taxed, it's already in the price.

That's what I always assumed.

You want to get really clever, log every transaction someone makes over the course of a year and then once a year, pop up a tax demand on entering a station.
Tells you to pay it. You could refuse and then you have a chance of getting attacked by a band of Tax Office ships. I can imagine these becoming shoot on sight ships.
Also, seeing as being in the tax service would be fairly dangerous, they would employ the best pilots, giving you missions to run for the tax office.
These missions would of course make you extremely unpopular with everyone.

I feel a fiction idea coming on...

This could then extend to an OXP for all those annoyances in life, like say traffic wardens, speed cameras, and such.
I imagine though that this would just give you more things to kill without regard. I quite fancy blasting the traffic wardens ships and speed cameras.

!m!

Perhaps tax collection could be subcontracted to the black monks, so it's either pay the tax or face the gunship. But the idea of tax-free Harmless pilots and then gradually progressing with an increase in tax seems sound to me, although a bit out of the mentality of the neoliberal black monks who would like nothing best than to bleed small-time traders dry.

If you scrape the station while docking, I could understand paying a small "docking fee" tax for that.
Much other taxes are best left out. They will likely annoy the vet players and defeat the new players.