Oolite Bulletins

Over time a few tools and documentation projects have been done to enhance the Oolite experience. Both for modifying Oolite, creating OXP's, testing and converting OXP's and enhancing game play in general. Some of these fit nicely into the Expansion Pack forum, some in the development section but some don't quite fit in anywhere and end up in the discussion thread. In particular I'm thinking of the following , but there are sure to be more:

Oolite Vector Maps by ClymAngus
Oolite Keyconfig by Svengali
Oolite Info by maaarcooose
MaterialsFinder by Svengali
Oolite Key Maps by Gimi

Possibly the Python scripts for converting models and XML plists to openstep plists. Maybe even discussions on the debug console, debug.oxp and the plist verifier script.

In my view these fall to quickly into obscurity on the bb. I would like opinions on whether this could warrant and additional forum, "Oolite tools and documentation"???, or a sticky thread or possibly a Wiki page linking to the threads on the bb and the downloads.

My sincere apologies if I have forgotten any tools or projects, but that would just build up under my concern/argument.

Any thoughts?

The two most obvious (and by far the oldest) tools would be DryDock and the Oolite Keymapper. Although the former has issues with OS X 10.5 and 10.6, and Ahruman has no plans of bringing it up to date (as far as I know).

Commander McLane wrote:

The two most obvious (and by far the oldest) tools would be DryDock and the Oolite Keymapper. Although the former has issues with OS X 10.5 and 10.6, and Ahruman has no plans of bringing it up to date (as far as I know).

Thank you, I know of them now that you mention them, but both are Mac only I believe. Probably the reason I forgot them. Any more tools out there?

Dry Dock is pretty dead. It hasn’t kept up with Oolite features, it’s PowerPC-only, and my Oolite time goes to other stuff. Like Oolite.

I started on a Dry Dock 2 as a test bed for Oolite 2’s graphics code, but that’s also pretty much dead.

Ahruman wrote:

Dry Dock is pretty dead. It hasn’t kept up with Oolite features, it’s PowerPC-only, and my Oolite time goes to other stuff. Like Oolite.
I started on a Dry Dock 2 as a test bed for Oolite 2’s graphics code, but that’s also pretty much dead.

I would never want you to prioritise differently

Ahruman wrote:

Oolite 2’s graphics code

<sighs wistfully>

I propose a new forum under the Oolite category with one thread per tool (alike to the one thread per OXP in the Expansion Packs forum) plus a wiki page.

I think they should be in a sub-forum under 'Oolite' or 'Oolite-Development' because the forum is the logical place to discuss them, they warrant being put together, and the threads on here work well for documentation and historical decision archival purposes.

The Material Test Suite thread may as well go straight in there.

Whether it should be under 'Oolite' or 'Oolite-Development' I cannot decide. Some are clearly developer's or debugger's tools, whilst others (e.g. related to key mapping) may be useful to a new user and of value even before installing .OXPs. And if someone writes a user-friendly tool to manage the downloading, installation and disabling of a range of .OXPs, is that a user tool or a development tool?

As for the Wiki, I would have thought that as it is a far more structured medium, there does not necessarily need to be a 'tools' section but would each have their own page(s) and be linked to from whatever relevant areas they relate to. One does not tend to search for a specific tool unless one knows it exists; a person with a problem searches for symptoms and is more likely to use the forum for that purpose than the Wiki. Having searched for "Can't find the cloaking device" and found there is a "core mission resetting tool" discussion thread, they would then follow the link from there to the Wiki for more details. Especially when the 'tool' in question is "open this editor and change this line from x to y".

Ahruman wrote:

Dry Dock is pretty dead. It hasn’t kept up with Oolite features, it’s PowerPC-only, and my Oolite time goes to other stuff. Like Oolite.

I started on a Dry Dock 2 as a test bed for Oolite 2’s graphics code, but that’s also pretty much dead.

On my system (Snow Leopard) I can still open DAT files with DryDock, which I sometimes do in order to check model dimensions. However, it's not possible to perform any more actions (like for instance open another DAT file). I have to immediately close DryDock, and can restart it with another model.

So there is some (admittedly very limited) usability left.

SandJ wrote:

One does not tend to search for a specific tool unless one knows it exists; a person with a problem searches for symptoms and is more likely to use the forum for that purpose than the Wiki.

It is largely about whether you start with details that pertain to your particular problem and eventually arrive at the big picture, or start with the big picture and drill down to the details. For some the first approach works better, for others it's the second way.

Have we ever thought of using the oolite.org website as a sort of portal to the forum? Instead of having pages of stickied threads, link to the more significant threads via the website.

Either that or, as someone already suggested, a slight restructuring of the categories on the forum might be a good idea. Move some of the stickied threads (especially the numerous ones in the Expansion Packs category) into a new category on their own (perhaps titled Design, Development and Technical?)

Gimi wrote:

Possibly the Python scripts for converting models and XML plists to openstep plists.

The WIKI has already a category (http://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/Catego ... te_Utility) for helpers.
A additional page which holds links to all converters doesn't hurt, similiar to the [wiki]List_of_software[/wiki] maybe.

Svengali wrote:

Gimi wrote:

Possibly the Python scripts for converting models and XML plists to openstep plists.

The WIKI has already a category (http://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/Catego ... te_Utility) for helpers.
A additional page which holds links to all converters doesn't hurt, similiar to the [wiki]List_of_software[/wiki] maybe.

Thanks Svengali, that helps lot, but does require the author to create a Wiki page.
I don't have any strong preferences either way. My concern is that there is quite a bit of useful work being done by the likes of you, maaarcooose and others that quickly fall into obscurity. For OXP's we have the OXP list and the Forum, that has become very good references. For documentation and tools the player has to go hunting, assuming he knows what he is looking for in the first place. If he doesn't know something exists, there is no way of finding it short of ploughing through the bb and wiki.
When I started playing Oolite some years ago I used to click on the web-sites in the profiles and links in the signatures of the users of the bb, and found a lot of OXP's not on Oosat in that way. I'm hoping for a way to give these tools more exposure.
I fully understand any reservations against making a new forum category. That will ultimately lead to more off topic posts and more work for the admins.
A third party tools list and third party documentation list similar to the OXP-list would probably do the trick. Would allow linking to both a bb thread and a separate Wiki page.

Maik, everybody. Is this a good idea.

Gimi wrote:

I fully understand any reservations against making a new forum category. That will ultimately lead to more off topic posts and more work for the admins.

I hope I'm not too ignorant about the admin work, but apart from the occasional thread split (about once per week) I don't see it...

Gimi wrote:

A third party tools list and third party documentation list similar to the OXP-list would probably do the trick. Would allow linking to both a bb thread and a separate Wiki page.
Maik, everybody. Is this a good idea.

Yes, this is what I was thinking of in my first reply in this thread.

maik wrote:

Gimi wrote:

I fully understand any reservations against making a new forum category. That will ultimately lead to more off topic posts and more work for the admins.

I hope I'm not too ignorant about the admin work, but apart from the occasional thread split (about once per week) I don't see it

It's all done quietly in the background... massive amounts of admin work!