Oolite Bulletins

Then I think we have found the cause of the crashes.

The message the small flashers give is : the big point at the center is where you need to be, ignore everything else..

It seems the design of the external docking system is like that of a an airfield / aircraft carrier runway where you need to be aligned properly or crash ?

That also explains why I prefer planetfall1 over planetfall 2 (which looks much better and has a lot more content) .
In PF1 landing is simple : you fly towards the planet surface and slow down.
Doing that with PF2 will give a message you are not aligned and have to pull up.

Changing the external docking design to a system where you fly to a point at a suitable speed and tractor beams (like huge cargo scoops) take care of bringing you in safely is one solution .

Assuming you want to keep the existing method :
align the runway with the spacebar so it's impossible to approach from below.

Lone_Wolf wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 9:19 am

It seems the design of the external docking system is like that of a an airfield / aircraft carrier runway where you need to be aligned properly or crash ?

No. The external dock system operates like, as you put it

Lone_Wolf wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 9:19 am

a system where you fly to a point at a suitable speed and tractor beams (like huge cargo scoops) take care of bringing you in safely

With the Space Bar, there is a very distinct external landing zone, which already has a big cross-hair mark on it to indicate where to land, and so I thought it was natural to put the docking point just above that mark. Approaching the docking point from beneath this point means you'll run into the station before getting to the docking point.

If I was to move the docking point into free space away from the station, then sure, you could come at it from any direction you like and it would dock you automatically. But I feel that would reduce the immersion experience that you're using the actual external dock of the station.

Lone_Wolf wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 9:19 am

align the runway with the spacebar so it's impossible to approach from below.

I'm afraid I don't understand this idea at all. Looking at the geometry of the station, leaving aside any of the flashers I add with the external docking system, the external landing pad on the Space Bar is *very clearly* only approachable from above, not from below. From above you can see the cross-hairs on the landing pad; from below all you see is structural elements with no markings at all. I really don't understand why you would ever try to approach from underneath.

I mean, if there were no flashers present, and you were told you could use the external landing pad, wouldn't you be aiming for that cross-hair mark, and therefore coming at it from above?

With PF2, I wanted to make the landing process more of an event: not just simply "pointing your ship at the planet", but something that needs some skill, just like docking at a normal Coriolis. So, while it uses the external docking system as the basis for it's operation, I added turbulence and the need to have a shallow approach angle. I could, theoretically, remove the need for the shallow approach angle, in which case it would be quite similar to PF1, but I feel it would lose a lot of the experience by doing that. However, if there are strong feelings against the approach I took I could potentially make the approach angle part of it optional.

phkb wrote:

I'm afraid I don't understand this idea at all. Looking at the geometry of the station, leaving aside any of the flashers I add with the external docking system, the external landing pad on the Space Bar is *very clearly* only approachable from above, not from below. From above you can see the cross-hairs on the landing pad; from below all you see is structural elements with no markings at all. I really don't understand why you would ever try to approach from underneath.

When entering anarchy systems I typically have to fight immediately at the WP.
Often the fight location moves away from the WP beacon .

Once that fight is finished I might head for the spacebar .
If I have the real life time to use autopilot docking I torus / inject until I'm less then 2 km away then initiate autopilot docking.

Incase I want to use the external docking I have to stop injecting about 5 km away to check where I have to fly. The direction from which I view the SB is entirely random.
Usually the external dock is not visible there, but the normal dock flashers and opposite of it the arrow flashers of the external dock are. So I fly towards the big point at the center of the arrow flashers and try to use it to dock.

I have succesfully docked that way several times (also had a few crashes) before I approached from a direction where I could see the crosshair symbol and realised the external dock was actually a platform extruding from the spacebar.

As for FP2 landing :
launch from main station
target one of the planetary landing buoys using the ASC
fly towards it and try to land on the planet
How many times do you try before giving up / are succesfull ?

Note that if you are flying WP - planet you are almost guaranteed to be aligned so are unlikely to notice the issue.


sidenote 1
The external docking platform reminds me of the plank where pirates force someone to walk-the-plank to show their courage (or get rid of them) in stories/movies/strips .
I like it and occasionally imagine clean pilots in spacesuits forcing a fugitive pilot (prob wearing a red spacesuit) to walk the plank.
There's a good chance I'll keep EDS installed even if I stop using the external docking.


sidenote 2
I very much like the space bar facelift oxp, it improves the SB a lot while keeping its spirit.

Lone_Wolf wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 1:38 pm

How many times do you try before giving up / are succesfull ?

Well, for me, I have a 100% success rate, but I'm starting to think I'm alone at that level.

Guess I'll be adding the "turn off the damned shallow approach system, for pete's sake" in the next PF2 release.

Lone_Wolf wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 1:38 pm

As for FP2 landing :
launch from main station
target one of the planetary landing buoys using the ASC
fly towards it and try to land on the planet
How many times do you try before giving up / are successful ?

Umm… you are trying to land on the planet surface - or to reach the great glowing light where the tractor beams grab you and then land you at the spaceport?

phkb wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 2:43 pm

Lone_Wolf wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 1:38 pm

How many times do you try before giving up / are succesfull ?

Well, for me, I have a 100% success rate, but I'm starting to think I'm alone at that level.

Guess I'll be adding the "turn off the damned shallow approach system, for pete's sake" in the next PF2 release.

I’m perfectly happy with PF2 as it is. I expect planetary landings to involve some difficulty, and mistakes to be costly (as with landing aircraft).

Cholmondely wrote:

Umm… you are trying to land on the planet surface - or to reach the great glowing light where the tractor beams grab you and then land you at the spaceport?

The first is how PF1 works, the second how PF2 works and what I've tried.

Mt results of trying to land on planets in past few months (order : crash - gave up - success )
PF 1 : 2 - 0 - 28
PF 2 :
- after flying from WP to planet
3 - 4 - 2
from main station
3 - 5 - 1

phkb wrote: ↑Mon Sep 29, 2025 2:43 pm

Guess I'll be adding the "turn off the damned shallow approach system, for pete's sake" in the next PF2 release.

Score currently with PF2 : 1 - 0 - 5
The one crash was because I didn't realise the docking point was on the opposite side of the planet .

The turbulence does make landing harder and to avoid explosion you need to fly very slow.
Compensating for the turbulence until I landed required 60+ seconds of intense focus.