As the pariah of the piece, I reserve the right to defend or crave forgiveness on a point by point basis, as Shylock did before me:
If I may begin the defense with an opening statement, the division of power always ends badly.
PhantorGorth wrote: Well it looks like people don't want what I have done.
Only 2 people have replied, and they have not said that your work is worthless only that there might be another way of putting it. No attack has been made against you or your work, only my late declaration of intent, and two voices lightly supporting my endeavor.
PhantorGorth wrote: Given that we seem to be mostly arguing over the my artistic parts which was never really encompassed by my scripts in the first place.
Your scripting has never been in doubt. You by far surpass me in that endeavor. Artistically and socio politically, I will admit that you are doing my head in. But that has always been expressed as a merely personal stand point. Your input has been invaluable as an early way of getting the feel of a map. And fundamentally understanding it as a living system. I get this by making a map from scratch. It takes me a little longer because I am an old thing and set in my ways.
PhantorGorth wrote:Unfortunately people are dissing whole thing because of these regions and such
NOT THE CASE. Don't do yourself the injustice of throwing the baby out with the bath water. This is a case of skills applied at the point where that skill is most useful. I've already listened to many ideas of yours from the maps and implemented them. Remember the Cat & Lizard issue, we resolved that and came round to your way of thinking BECAUSE IT WAS A GOOD IDEA. Because ALL are not applied does not mean that a good number are not useful, and better than most people can come up with.
PhantorGorth wrote:The underlying coded generated bit just does the systems, routes, key, title and credits and most of these are editable in the map file and not hard coded. The aim of doing something more interactive was a secondary goal for later
With this you have surpassed all of us. But maybe this could be seen to be too much too soon. If we can debate and evolve things (which you are very much still a part of) then we will come out at the end of the day with a good bedrock that makes sense. You have to admit that you have a habit of trying to provoke a reaction. That may not be the best way of making the basic aspects of this project progress.
PhantorGorth wrote:Ok, people don't like the regions stuff I did. If you read back I originally did a version of the map with them in only to point out the things I noticed. I was hoping for everyone else's input and got no response
Yeah, your possibly one of the only other people who understands the deafening roar of silence. And although my efforts may be flawed, I would be doing the wider board a disservice if I did not at least proffer an alternative. In starting a discussion it would appear my action has been perceived as starting a fight. Not my intention.
PhantorGorth wrote:so I put my artistic bits in the main G6 map and also said I would happily remove them. No one has asked me to do so. Maybe I overstepped my mark by putting them in the first place but there you go
The more of this I'm reading the more I feel that this is my fault (hell I thought it was my fault already but there are degrees of faultiness). It can be said that maybe when you came to me with a “quick” solution to the map issue, I should have said “F*** off”. I didn't, and here is where we have ended up as a result. Maybe when map 6 all got a bit colour match, I again, should have been the one to say “Phantor, stop goading a reaction. This is the way we should go about this”. AND Admittedly I have been sending out mixed signals about chairing this production and not being the kind of C**t necessary to demand the respect of being project leader. But then..... I didn't want to, I tried to include as many people as possible. Yeah with hind sight, that didn't seem to have worked too well either.
PhantorGorth wrote:I was also hoping that Clym would take control again from me as soon as his head round my method but that never happened.
This is the issue, in the absence of comment the mind goes mad. Case in point I thought most people liked your map hence the oblique statement of intent. Is it possible that both our positions are build on assumption after assumption in a vaccum of silence? Eather way I'm perfectly willing to defend my alterations to your chart 6, I hope you would find them logical and well reasoned.
PhantorGorth wrote:My original aim was to be helpful by doing the parts that were tedious so Clym could get to the interesting part quickly and accurately. Clym if you find my methods an anathama and "sucks every ounce of joy out of map making" and don't want to use it I'm not forcing you
Yes I do. BUT for you this enables active comment on systems and to pick up on the things I have missed, you get the broad brush strokes. Case in point: Map 6 divided down (a touch by popular opinion) on colour. This is the first thing the eye reacts to when presented with the map. By making every small part, I get to see political systems and route connections and from there make informed guesses on what I've seen. Both perspectives have merit. I hope we can combine them, with the way your talking it sounds like you have no wish to. Which would be a pity and a loss to the maps in general.
PhantorGorth wrote:Well, tonight I will remove my regions stuff and publish my code as is. If Clym or someone else wants to use my code feel free because it looks like I won't be.
DON'T YOU BLOODY DARE! I need your work to give me an over view. If you don't want to be a part of 7 and 8 then that's your choice, but your a big part of this map weather you like it or not. To delete your work would be the act of a coward, and your not one.
PhantorGorth wrote:
Its all your's Clym good luck with it.
Not said without an ounce of flounce, but acceptably so! I would do no less put in your position, and feeling the way you do. It was never all mine, you of all people should know that.
Basically I don't want you to piss off with the hump, you have good ideas. But I will have these 8 charts done to a basic level of sense and logic before I hand it off. Where we go from here is up to you. If it's any consolation I am deeply sorry if I have at any time caused you offense or berated your considerable body of work. This is now your decision.