Split: Player Ship Lasers

[Eric Walch]

Have you tried setting is_subminution in shipdata?

Don't bother looking. That key also needs that the owner is defined as missile. Just spawning won't work

[Switeck]

That said I am going to test using becomeExplosion on contact, which may be a route to awarding kills.

I've noticed missiles often shattering for very low damage if they hit a target other than their intended target. They also shatter without exploding if they impact a target very quickly after launching. I guess you could set the projectile's density stupidly high, but it would still be delivering very low damage due to its small size and lack of an explosion...and it also wouldn't award kills and such.

[Commander McLane]

Turns out I could solve practically all problems by script.

Behold, a completely new weapon system: the  Fauchon-Oliphant X-series of precision railguns!

Feedback welcomed (better in its own thread than here, please).

[JensAyton]

I've noticed missiles often shattering for very low damage if they hit a target other than their intended target. They also shatter without exploding if they impact a target very quickly after launching.

Missiles fly straight and dumb for 0.5 seconds after launch, then arm and start tracking the target. They only detonate if they come within 25 metres of the intended target, and sometimes when ECMed in the case of hardheads. See missileAI.plist (The EXPLODE state is what you call “shattering”, and DETONATE is a full explosion).

[Zireael]

Back to the topic of player ship lasers, I think the solution for the future could be: max 2 lasers to each given view, and they'd cross in the crosshairs.

And set them so you can fire them continuously for, let's say, 5 seconds and no more, thus eliminating the hard-to-explain overheating in space. Well, if we have non-Newtonian physics, why have this overheating...? Let's say it's the way the lasers are built in Ooniverse that they can't fire longer.

[JensAyton]

Back to the topic of player ship lasers, I think the solution for the future could be: max 2 lasers to each given view, and they'd cross in the crosshairs.

Um… a convergence point needs to be specified in three dimensions. If they crossed at the crosshairs, you’d be constantly shooting yourself in the face. :-)

And set them so you can fire them continuously for, let's say, 5 seconds and no more, thus eliminating the hard-to-explain overheating in space. Well, if we have non-Newtonian physics, why have this overheating...? Let's say it's the way the lasers are built in Ooniverse that they can't fire longer.

Um, what? Overheating in space makes perfect sense. Saying “they arbitrarily can’t fire longer than five seconds” does not.

[Commander McLane]

Back to the topic of player ship lasers, I think the solution for the future could be: max 2 lasers to each given view, and they'd cross in the crosshairs.

Um… a convergence point needs to be specified in three dimensions. If they crossed at the crosshairs, you’d be constantly shooting yourself in the face.

Besides, not even the current single laser touches the crosshairs. Usually the aiming point of the laser is a couple of pixels below the crosshair centre. This is because your view position =/= the barrel of your laser.

[Mauiby de Fug]

Besides, not even the current single laser touches the crosshairs. Usually the aiming point of the laser is a couple of pixels below the crosshair centre. This is because your view position =/= the barrel of your laser.

Not quite true Depends on the ship. In the standard Caduceus, it was designed for accuracy by doing exactly that. However, it produces some rather odd (and distracting) effects, so I tweaked mine slightly. So I have an almost accurate ship, which is still better than the norm...

Edit: Just noticed that you said "usually". Whoops... And the Caddy is an oxp ship rather than vanilla, so you're right if you just consider those...

[Commander McLane]

The Caddy is the only ship with view position = laser position, amongst what may well be hundreds of different ship types available for Oolite. This makes it into an exception, not the general rule. And given the numbers (hundreds to 1) it's not even an exception that has to be especially mentioned each time.

[Mauiby de Fug]

Hence I had edited my post when I re-read and noticed your use of the word "usually"! I'm the sort of person who has a habit of pointing out exceptions if they exist. I have an obsession with completeness, and tend to make sure all cases are taken care of. And I nowhere stated that it was a general rule.

[Commander McLane]

I just think that any informed Caduceus pilot knows that his ship is the exception anyway. Actually I hadn't even thought about the Caddy. The 'usually' was meant to indicate that the exact number of pixels varies with distance from your target (rather cryptic, I admit).

If you happen to fly a Caddy you'd of course be more aware of its special feature. If I'd happen to fly a Caddy it would be the first thing I would change (or the second, after removing the plasma turrets and the ability to mount certain military equipment which in my own private Ooniverse doesn't exist). For me the Caddy is a ship that at least bends, if not breaks some of Oolite's rules (note: I am of course only talking about my own private interpretation of Oolite's rules, not about forcing them upon others), therefore I tend to not consider it when I make generalized statements about how Oolite works.

[Mauiby de Fug]

It hadn't even occurred to me that the laser accuracy could be against anyone's ooniverse rules (The other features I can easily understand)! But I see where you're coming from.

[Commander McLane]

It hadn't even occurred to me that the laser accuracy could be against anyone's ooniverse rules (The other features I can easily understand)! But I see where you're coming from.

Not the accuracy, but the fact that the camera would have to be located in the middle of the laser beam. How would that technically work? I'm just taking the parallax resulting from the difference between the laser position and the view position as a given for any ship. Once you've got a feeling for how big it is, there's no difference in accuracy. It's simply a matter of aiming slightly above your target (and exactly how slightly depends on the distance).

I also didn't like the optical effect of the flickering cross, but this could be overcome if there was an option to make the laser beam invisible altogether. (There was one version of Oolite where the view_position_foo keys were broken, resulting in your view always being from 0,0,0. That was when I observed the flickering cross for the first time on ships which had a laser position very close to 0,0,n.)

[Commander Wilmot]

What if the lasers crossed at their max range? If the lasers are close or next to each other, then they would be fairly accurate against all but the smallest ships, which would be a fair trade off, I think.

Back to the topic of player ship lasers, I think the solution for the future could be: max 2 lasers to each given view, and they'd cross in the crosshairs.

Um… a convergence point needs to be specified in three dimensions. If they crossed at the crosshairs, you’d be constantly shooting yourself in the face.

the convergence point could vary based upon the laser.

The Caddy is the only ship with view position = laser position, amongst what may well be hundreds of different ship types available for Oolite. This makes it into an exception, not the general rule. And given the numbers (hundreds to 1) it's not even an exception that has to be especially mentioned each time.

I'm pretty sure the fer de lance 3g (third generation) has this too; and the neolite version of the cobra rapier has the forward laser appear at the top of screen when you are looking forward, which gives a similar effect, I think. (though I found it annoying)

[Cmdr Wyvern]

The Caddy is the only ship with view position = laser position, amongst what may well be hundreds of different ship types available for Oolite.

The Caddy isn't the only ship with this feature. The Kirin has zero parallax sighting as well.

That was due to laser_position being broken a few version back.
Oh well. Being the long-range snipemaster that I am, I happen to like zero parallax despite the big cross appearing when the laser is fired. Nothing like laser etching your name in a Sidewinder's hull from 30km.