Oolite Bulletins

Possibly because individual systems are protective of their own authority. A private individual pursuing a lawbreaker for fun and profit across borders is one thing: police ships from one star system barging in to enforce the law in another star system would be something else entirely. I've always assumed that local police forces are funded by, and are at least partially loyal to, each individual system - that's why you get more cops in a Corporate State, because the planetary government stumps up the cash. There doesn't seem to be a federal force with overarching authority within the Co-operative - apart perhaps from the Navy, and they're spread very thin. It's a very loose alliance, I think.

Disembodied wrote:

I've always assumed that local police forces are funded by, and are at least partially loyal to, each individual system

Which leads me to another, Oofic-oriented, question: who actually polices main stations - GalCop or the local constabulary?

El Viejo wrote:

Which leads me to another, Oofic-oriented, question: who actually polices main stations - GalCop or the local constabulary?

I'm not totally certain there's much of a difference. The Co-operative provides the technical details (the Vipers, the stations) to even out discrepancies in technology levels, but the local planet has to cough up the funds to pay for it (maybe there's some funding for poorer/less organised systems drawn from richer ones, in the interests of maintaining long-distance trade routes). Probably they supply the bulk of the personnel, too. I'd guess though that a main station was technically "Co-operative territory", so any security personnel would represent the Co-operative.

It would probably depend on what the local system was like. A sophisticated world, with several busy trade routes, would probably have a wide mix of species acting as police, dock personnel, station administration, traders and so on. A backwater might be mostly staffed by locals, with one or two exotic wash-ups filling the odd niche. Some systems might be enthusiastic members of the Co-operative; others might have a more fraught and antagonistic relationship, forever complaining about GalCop high-handedness and intrusiveness, and threatening to secede.

El Viejo wrote:

Which leads me to another, Oofic-oriented, question: who actually polices main stations - GalCop or the local constabulary?

For me it's GalCop. The stations are owned and run by GalCop, and for me policing is one of the specifics of running a station. GalCop may of course use a mix of local and foreign personnel.

I'd expect local constabulary only on the planet, and perhaps in the shuttle bays of the station, co-responsible for border control and customs for those travelers who wish to descend to the planet.

My tuppence-worth on some of the points in this thread.

El Viejo wrote:

...who actually polices main stations - GalCop or the local constabulary?

As I understand things, the actual stations are GalCop property and I would therefore assume that principal jurisdiction lies with GalCop, although it is reasonable to assume that the system authorities would have a presence there as well.
It would also be logical to assume that the system authorities would have the option to sponsor extra GalCop police if they wanted to, hence the greater number of police vessels in the stable systems.
As for the police pursuing offenders to other systems, again this would seem reasonable particularly for fugitives.
I also like the idea that GalCop vessels should have a 'self-destruct' mechanism. And if this became the case, then they should be fitted with escape capsules as well. It is reasonable to assume that a GalCop police pilot is a highly trained individual who's loss should be undesirable. I am also of the view that the Viper should have scoops and a nominal 1TC hold designed specifically for escape-capsule recovery to facilitate the rescue/capture of pilots who have lost their ship.

Disembodied wrote:

There doesn't seem to be a federal force with overarching authority within the Co-operative - apart perhaps from the Navy, and they're spread very thin.

I think GalCop is the authority, and their power does seem pretty ubiquitous...they are present in every system (even the un-reachable ones!) but are not a 'Federal' force - their role is more one of controlling commerce and upholding the Law.
I don't think the 'Navy' is relevant here. In core Oolite the Navy hardly features, and any OXP naval presence is mostly concerned with the Thargoid threat (although they do occassionally 'police' pirates which to my mind is not consistent with the way the Ooniverse works - that's the job of the GalCop police).

Disembodied wrote:

I've always assumed that local police forces are funded by, and are at least partially loyal to, each individual system - that's why you get more cops in a Corporate State, because the planetary government stumps up the cash.

Anarchies (and for that matter Feudals) seem rather disinclined to pay up for any cops at all, but still get some. I imagine there's a little bit of cross-subsidy going on just to keep interplanetary trade and travel going.

It's probably also a matter of goals - the point of the police patrols is to keep key spacelanes and the area around the station relatively safe. If they chase offenders who are leaving the system, then:
1) it could be a feint
2) it also could be an ambush (and an ambush on witchspace exit can be extremely nasty)
Easier to just assume that with a fugitive rating from resisting arrest there'll be some bounty hunter at the other end willing to have a go at them. For about fifty credits - the fuel to jump an Interceptor 7LY and back would cost almost that much, never mind missiles, repairs, etc. - Galcop can have all but the very toughest pirate killed by some semi-sociopath who is looking for an excuse for socially-sanctioned destruction.

Disembodied wrote:

others might have a more fraught and antagonistic relationship, forever complaining about GalCop high-handedness and intrusiveness, and threatening to secede.

My personal canon - which is perhaps a little unconventional - has it that the eight governmental categories are extremely broad: for instance a Communist system could be the Soviet-style bureaucratic/military dystopias seen in Commies OXP, or a "barely avoided Anarchy classification" bunch of hippies, or a system where social pressure rather than a powerful state enforces a dull conformism.

In this, Feudal and Anarchy are those systems where Galcop is unable to come to an agreement with the system government (in an Anarchy, there's either no government or none willing to even talk to them) and is solely restricted to a cheap orbital station for diplomatic and basic trade purposes. (As a consequence, insuring major trade convoys to the system becomes prohibitively expensive, and the system's economy and TL suffers badly) An actual "knights and nobility" style Feudal system could end up, if they were to reach an agreement with Galcop, in either Dictatorship or Confederacy easily enough, or perhaps even Corporate State. Perhaps some of them already have...

This explains - to my satisfaction at least - why Feudal and Anarchy are capped to particular low-end economies, and why "Feudal" is more dangerous than "Dictatorship" when you'd expect it to be the other way around.

Thanks guys - all good stuff for my immersed, Oofic-addled brain. Personally, I tend to think that GalCop jurisdiction ends at the dock, which is why I can dock as an offender/fugitive and I'm safe until I launch again (apart from occasional fines and cleaning-up after the Batoids, which is enforced by the local cops. I'll not get into 'attitude adjustment' - heh). It certainly helps with the Oofic that GalCop cannot touch me when I'm on a main station - they can 'schedule me for termination' outside the station, but not within it.

cim wrote:

For about fifty credits - the fuel to jump an Interceptor 7LY and back would cost almost that much, never mind missiles, repairs, etc.

That would only be one way, as the Interceptor would have a free ride through the player's wormhole.

cim wrote:

My personal canon - which is perhaps a little unconventional - has it that the eight governmental categories are extremely broad: for instance a Communist system could be the Soviet-style bureaucratic/military dystopias seen in Commies OXP, or a "barely avoided Anarchy classification" bunch of hippies, or a system where social pressure rather than a powerful state enforces a dull conformism.

I'm with you on this, very much so - apart from anything else, these are classifications that cut across not only cultures but species/phylum/class too. It would be an interesting question whether or not a society of intelligent social ant- or bee-like insects was a form of Communism or Dictatorship or something else entirely, depending on, say, how a Queen is chosen (or indeed how individual hives interact across the planet). And of course not all insects are social.

cim wrote:

In this, Feudal and Anarchy are those systems where Galcop is unable to come to an agreement with the system government (in an Anarchy, there's either no government or none willing to even talk to them) and is solely restricted to a cheap orbital station for diplomatic and basic trade purposes. (As a consequence, insuring major trade convoys to the system becomes prohibitively expensive, and the system's economy and TL suffers badly) An actual "knights and nobility" style Feudal system could end up, if they were to reach an agreement with Galcop, in either Dictatorship or Confederacy easily enough, or perhaps even Corporate State. Perhaps some of them already have...

This explains - to my satisfaction at least - why Feudal and Anarchy are capped to particular low-end economies, and why "Feudal" is more dangerous than "Dictatorship" when you'd expect it to be the other way around.

"Feudal" could range from anything from a strongly stratified caste system to planet-wide manorialism (like in Dune, I suppose) to semi-anarchic warlordism, with the "monarch" simply being the biggest and nastiest warlord currently around. And an Anarchy could be anything from feral survivalists to peaceful individualists. Corporate States could range from giant family concerns where everyone pulls together for the common good to dystopian Blade Runner-esque cyberpunk misery. From a Co-operative (and player) point of view, though, it really all comes down to how much money they're prepared to stump up to help keep the spacelanes safe.

"Pirate" is probably a flexible term too ... it could cover anything from a simple thief to someone with a political mindset hostile to the Co-operative, or to the local planetary government, or both ...

cim wrote:

Galcop can have all but the very toughest pirate killed by some semi-sociopath who is looking for an excuse for socially-sanctioned destruction.

Heh... this is the main reason I hunt bounty-hunters whenever I can!

(moved query on Griff's shipset to Griff's normalmapped ship remakes thread)

<nods in thanks>

Thanks mister moderator , I should have realized there'd be a thread for it.