Oolite Bulletins

hiran wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 3:06 pm

phkb wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 2:01 pm

Switeck wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 12:53 pm

Any clue why it's gone?

It's not gone. It's still there:


The only difference is, rather than having 3 boxes with three identical links to the same app, we've now got a bigger section for it with one link.

There was a short section about it on the right hand side before. That is now central. But it does no longer get the attention the links in the download box received, and thus the whole story repeats. Would you suggest we leave it as it is?

If what you had before was generating more downloads, then perhaps it should be replaced.

To my mind what makes Oolite are the OXPs. There are many other free games out there which are superior to vanilla Oolite. Even with the improvements in graphics, it is the planet textures and the ships, stations and other gubbins which give the new player something to "see".

We need an easy fix for the lack of an easy dumb-pilot usable connection to the OXP library. Only Oolite Starter provides this at the moment - unless the new player looks a little further and downloads a nightly.

phkb wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 2:01 pm

Switeck wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 12:53 pm

Any clue why it's gone?

It's not gone. It's still there:

The only difference is, rather than having 3 boxes with three identical links to the same app, we've now got a bigger section for it with one link.

Indeed, there used to be the same Starter link in each of the three different boxes. I thought Starter was treated as an add-on just like all the other links below, and putting the same links in every box seemed looks like (only IMHO) "spammy". I suggested and then moved the Starter to the first section below the boxes. I added a description and tried to arrange everything uniformly... Did it become bad? People no longer see the line "Download OoliteStarter from GitHub." which is under the boxes?

Folks, if you think that it is necessary to place a link to the Starter in each box, I will return it as it was. As you wish.

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:34 am

Folks, if you think that it is necessary to place a link to the Starter in each box, I will return it as it was. As you wish.

Please do!

We're losing Windows 32-bit. We're losing the AppleMac. We might be losing some of the Linux versions (Debian?).

Without Oolite Starter those of us who are not software engineers have lost the Expansions too.

Cholmondely wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 9:52 am

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:34 am

Folks, if you think that it is necessary to place a link to the Starter in each box, I will return it as it was. As you wish.

Please do!

We're losing Windows 32-bit. We're losing the AppleMac. We might be losing some of the Linux versions (Debian?).

Without Oolite Starter those of us who are not software engineers have lost the Expansions too.

Links to 32-bit Windows exists in box, with comment, Mac and Linux exists... what we lose?

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 10:06 am

Cholmondely wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 9:52 am

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:34 am

Folks, if you think that it is necessary to place a link to the Starter in each box, I will return it as it was. As you wish.

Please do!

We're losing Windows 32-bit. We're losing the AppleMac. We might be losing some of the Linux versions (Debian?).

Without Oolite Starter those of us who are not software engineers have lost the Expansions too.

Links to 32-bit Windows exists in box, with comment, Mac and Linux exists... what we lose?

We are "losing" - not we have "lost". I can't play anything other than the February 2022 version of v.1.91 on my AppleMac (and it crashes all the time!). When 1.92 comes out I'll be stuffed. As will Aegidian himself. And such recent members as sharpenedblade & edsel 6502

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 10:06 am

Cholmondely wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 9:52 am

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 6:34 am

Folks, if you think that it is necessary to place a link to the Starter in each box, I will return it as it was. As you wish.

Please do!

We're losing Windows 32-bit. We're losing the AppleMac. We might be losing some of the Linux versions (Debian?).

Without Oolite Starter those of us who are not software engineers have lost the Expansions too.

Links to 32-bit Windows exists in box, with comment, Mac and Linux exists... what we lose?

'What we loose' is a summary. What happens really is that users download the game and do not notice the text about OoliteStarter or what it does. After installation they run the vanilla game, which cannot compete with other today's games. The graphics is old-fashioned and it is not possible to install addons.

This first impression intermingles with other games that work properly and/or have modern graphics. It looks like they exit the game and don't come back.

Do not feel guilty if you modified the site. You did something to improve, asked in the forum and noone shouted. Why should we? Noone could estimate that impact - and even today we are just guessing that there is a missing link.

I can bring it back today.

I made some changes to the downloads page. Do you think this is not enough? Is it still necessary to put a link to the starter into each block? Maybe we should add an explanation - why is it "highly recommended" to install the Starter at the moment?

hiran wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 12:56 pm

I can bring it back today.

I ask you to allow me, if you confirm that this is necessary.

I'm hesitant to interject here, but I will anyway. When I wanted to fire up Oolite a fortnight ago, I knew what I wanted so I just headed straight for the most recent nightly. So, I haven't experienced downloading a normal build from the oolite.space website. So, perhaps I misunderstand the discussion here.

But, if I'm reading your comments correctly, normal builds of Oolite have the address oolite.org hard-coded into the oxz-manager, so people trying to use it are receiving pornography or some-such, instead of the oxz manifest thingy. Is that correct?

Wildeblood wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:18 pm

I'm hesitant to interject here, but I will anyway. When I wanted to fire up Oolite a fortnight ago, I knew what I wanted so I just headed straight for the most recent nightly. So, I haven't experienced downloading a normal build from the oolite.space website. So, perhaps I misunderstand the discussion here.

But, if I'm reading your comments correctly, normal builds of Oolite have the address oolite.org hard-coded into the oxz-manager, so people trying to use it are receiving pornography or some-such, instead of the oxz manifest thingy. Is that correct?

In general, approximately yes.

I just checked - the old address on oolite.org gives a 404-Not Found error.

And the discussion was about how prominent the OoliteStarter link should be. It turned out that if the link to it is not placed directly in the boxes with links to the game, people are less likely to download it. And this leads to undesirable consequences - the oxz-manager does not work for the current version 1.9, and beginners are disappointed

Wildeblood wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:18 pm

I'm hesitant to interject here, but I will anyway. When I wanted to fire up Oolite a fortnight ago, I knew what I wanted so I just headed straight for the most recent nightly. So, I haven't experienced downloading a normal build from the oolite.space website. So, perhaps I misunderstand the discussion here.

But, if I'm reading your comments correctly, normal builds of Oolite have the address oolite.org hard-coded into the oxz-manager, so people trying to use it are receiving pornography or some-such, instead of the oxz manifest thingy. Is that correct?

Almost.

Thanks to the subscription on Oolite.org not being paid, we lost it. Timer set up Oolite.space instead. All sorts of issues transpired. The most important was the loss of the download address for the oxz manifest thingy which means that all the pre-Nightly versions can't use the in-game Expansions Manager without a knowledgeable tweaker tweaking it.

So dumb pilots like myself can't easily access the OXZs. If Hiran had not personally showed me how to use the Terminal programme on the AppleMac, I would still be unable to use the Expansions Manager.

The new owners of Oolite.org were accused of spreading viruses, I understand.

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:34 pm

And this leads to undesirable consequences - the oxz-manager does not work for the current version 1.9, and beginners are disappointed

And how many minutes would it take to rebuild the 1.90 downloads, if the only change that's needed is one website address? And why has no-one done that?

Wildeblood wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:40 pm

And how many minutes would it take to rebuild the 1.90 downloads, if the only change that's needed is one website address? And why has no-one done that?

As far as I understand, a lot of work has been done to restore the chain of building new versions for Windows. If I understand the situation correctly, it is not possible to rebuild version 1.9. Today I seriously thought about trying to correct the address inside a binary file using a hex editor. I have a similar experience.

Wildeblood wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:40 pm

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:34 pm

And this leads to undesirable consequences - the oxz-manager does not work for the current version 1.9, and beginners are disappointed

And how many minutes would it take to rebuild the 1.90 downloads, if the only change that's needed is one website address? And why has no-one done that?

It's not the rebuilds.

The process of issuing a new version (now that we are on Github?) has become a bureaucratic nightmare.

So much so, that it now involves the entire staff of your anaconda: legal experts, assistants to the legal experts, Autotrade Reporters, Purchase Bookers, Turbotraders, Legality Reminders, a dozen or so Yodas and a score of Trading Autotrade Reporters. We can't even get them to agree - never mind do anything.

I sit here in glorious England with my gin-and-tonic firmly ensconced in hand, scratching my head in befuzzlement.

Edited to add ... with the other hand

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:46 pm

Today I seriously thought about trying to correct the address inside a binary file using a hex editor. I have a similar experience.

Ah, the good ol' days of crackz and warez. It's like the internet of old. No, don't try editing an existing binary, there'll be checksums and things that will puke, then the FBI will come and kick your door in.

But, I find it implausible that the process of building a 1.90.1 version to, in essence, fix a typo, takes weeks not minutes.

Wildeblood wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 2:05 pm

timer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 1:46 pm

Today I seriously thought about trying to correct the address inside a binary file using a hex editor. I have a similar experience.

Ah, the good ol' days of crackz and warez. It's like the internet of old. No, don't try editing an existing binary, there'll be checksums and things that will puke, then the FBI will come and kick your door in.

The usual thing...

Wildeblood wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 2:05 pm

But, I find it implausible that the process of building a 1.90.1 version to, in essence, fix a typo, takes weeks not minutes.

I think @hiran can tell you a lot more about this than I know )