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Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:30 am
by Diziet Sma
Ok.. thanks for that, Thargoid.. I will do some further testing on it soon.. as things stand, the problem is very reproducible, until Planetfall is removed, after which it doesn't trigger any more. That's about as far as I've gotten with it, at this point. As the guy who knows the code intimately, any suggestions you may have re testing, etc, will be gratefully received.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:39 pm
by Thargoid
You could have a look at worldScripts["PlanetFall"].lastPlanet and worldScripts["PlanetFall"].messageBlock to see what their values are when the problem occurs. Also whether the timer worldScripts["PlanetFall"].landingTimer exists or not, and if so what it's value is and whether it's running or not.
Basically PF triggers off player.alertAltitude and this.shipApproachingPlanetSurface(), no reference is made at all to the ship's temperature (reading or modifying).
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:14 pm
by Diziet Sma
Thanks for the tips.. I'll see what I can find out.
Thargoid wrote:Basically PF triggers off player.alertAltitude and this.shipApproachingPlanetSurface(), no reference is made at all to the ship's temperature (reading or modifying).[/color]
I wasn't actually suggesting that PF itself was causing the ship to burn up.. simply that perhaps it's putting something or other into a state that Oolite itself is somehow then misinterpreting.. and there's still a good chance I've missed something.. my current theory is just based on observations to date.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 4:53 pm
by cim
Planetfall I suspect is a red herring. It's just that without it installed you don't tend to head too close to the planet.
When you approach a planet, the sky changes colour, and atmospheric friction begins. As you leave, it changes back and friction decreases. It doesn't always decrease to zero, however, because of frame rate interpolation - and then it's at value slightly above zero.
That's not normally a problem - until you accelerate to ridiculous speeds, at which point the tiny residual friction burns your ship up.
A floor on the atmospheric density required to cause frictional heating should fix that - I'll sort this out tonight.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 6:25 pm
by Redspear
Interesting. In testing, I never 'burned up' when using torus. It would only happen under normal speed when very close to a planet's surface. At that speed there was plenty of time to slow down to avoid that fate. At *8 decelleration I don't think there'd be a problem...
Dizzy, changing to *6 seems logical but bear in mind that with laser ranges shrunk more than the scanner, the significance of drift has also changed under some circumstances.
Thanks both. Without your help cim, I'd still be code hunting...
Edited to add...
In testing for 1.80 I opften used much bigger decelleration values and all was fine. I used * 50 when the torus multiplier was 'only' * 100 and don't recall any problems...
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 3:28 am
by Diziet Sma
cim wrote:Planetfall I suspect is a red herring. It's just that without it installed you don't tend to head too close to the planet.
When you approach a planet, the sky changes colour, and atmospheric friction begins. As you leave, it changes back and friction decreases. It doesn't always decrease to zero, however, because of frame rate interpolation - and then it's at value slightly above zero.
That's not normally a problem - until you accelerate to ridiculous speeds, at which point the tiny residual friction burns your ship up.
A floor on the atmospheric density required to cause frictional heating should fix that - I'll sort this out tonight.
Interesting.. .. with PF installed, it was consistently burning up.. I then tested with PF removed, flying down to barely above the surface before heading for the sun, and couldn't trigger the problem. However, I admit I only checked that a couple of times.. maybe I was just "lucky" on those two occasions. Probably, more extensive testing would have shown that PF was not involved.
Thanks for the fix..
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 10:05 am
by Zireael
Downloaded Dizzy's rescale execs, going to check if my trunk's up to date and then probably gonna see how Redspear's work looks like live!
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:11 am
by Redspear
Hi Zireael.
Don't forget the oxp part
here or things will be rather odd...
Hope you like it
Dizzy, you have the first post in this thread, could I trouble you to update it with some signposting to relevant links please?
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:45 pm
by Zireael
Can't run Dizzy's 16 and 4 on Win64 bit due to not finding js32ECMAv5dbg.dll.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:56 pm
by another_commander
Zireael wrote:Can't run Dizzy's 16 and 4 on Win64 bit due to not finding js32ECMAv5dbg.dll.
You can download the required dll from
here.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 4:02 am
by Diziet Sma
Redspear wrote:Dizzy, you have the first post in this thread, could I trouble you to update it with some signposting to relevant links please?
Done.. let me know if you think it needs anything more.
another_commander wrote:Zireael wrote:Can't run Dizzy's 16 and 4 on Win64 bit due to not finding js32ECMAv5dbg.dll.
You can download the required dll from
here.
Sorry about that.. future
Dizzy's Build™ downloads will include the dll as well. Now that cim has fixed the air-resistance bug, new builds will be uploaded shortly.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 8:43 am
by Diziet Sma
Having now gotten to grips with the mysteries of
Code: Select all
git stash
git pull
git submodule update
git stash apply
I've updated the code to include cim's and another_commander's latest bugfixes, and uploaded a new zip of executables. The new zip also has a copy of
js32ECMAv5dbg.dll for anyone who may need it.
The latest set contains 6 executables, as follows:
8 and 4
12 and 4
16 and 4
8 and 6
12 and 6
16 and 6
Basically, the first number refers to general Torus deceleration, and the second number to mass-locked deceleration. The aim is to see which combination of values gives the best feel in gameplay. See the included Readme file in the zip for more detail.
Download
here (same link as before)
Happy testing, and please report back with your results and impressions.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 6:02 pm
by Tricky
cim wrote:Planetfall I suspect is a red herring. It's just that without it installed you don't tend to head too close to the planet.
When you approach a planet, the sky changes colour, and atmospheric friction begins. As you leave, it changes back and friction decreases. It doesn't always decrease to zero, however, because of frame rate interpolation - and then it's at value slightly above zero.
That's not normally a problem - until you accelerate to ridiculous speeds, at which point the tiny residual friction burns your ship up.
A floor on the atmospheric density required to cause frictional heating should fix that - I'll sort this out tonight.
At extremely high speeds there should be some danger of "burning up" from smashing into any tiny elements in space. Maybe that is a bit too real life for some though.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:33 pm
by Diziet Sma
Tricky wrote:At extremely high speeds there should be some danger of "burning up" from smashing into any tiny elements in space.
But not at what is still just a paltry fraction of C, surely.. and it wasn't "some" danger.. it was practically guaranteed, once the condition was triggered. Nor was it, I believe, only a danger in the rescaled Oolite.. the new changes to trunk meant it was also going to cause problems for 1.82.
Re: Split: Re-scaling experiment
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:36 pm
by Tricky
Diziet Sma wrote:Tricky wrote:At extremely high speeds there should be some danger of "burning up" from smashing into any tiny elements in space.
But not at what is still just a paltry fraction of C, surely.. and it wasn't "some" danger.. it was practically guaranteed, once the condition was triggered.
I know, I was suggesting a new mechanic because of the higher speeds now available.
