Oolite Bulletins

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:58 pm**

Yes, the player ship and demo-ships! Another of the reasons I have so far kept Smivs'Shipset as it is.
You see as it currently works it just 'naturally' gives the player the re-texture (providing theirs is a core ship of course) and automatically shows the shipset ships on the demo-ships parade.
In re-naming the ships and adding a shipdata-overrides.plist this functionality would be lost.
I have to consider that most of the users of my shipset (over 1000 in total since the launch of v3) are simply wanting to replace the default textures, and the current arrangement is by far the best for this. They download and instal the OXP, and all the ships in-game get the new textures, the demo-ship parade gets the new textures and the player gets the new texture for their Cobby 3 or whatever. It is very hard for me to justify changeing this for the handful of users who may wish to use my shipset in tandem with other shipsets.

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:23 pm**

Smivs wrote:
It is very hard for me to justify changeing this for the handful of users who may wish to use my shipset in tandem with other shipsets.

Well, then what if you provided two versions of the oxp - a "unique" and a "tandem" version"?

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:11 pm**

Lestradae wrote:
Smivs wrote:
It is very hard for me to justify changeing this for the handful of users who may wish to use my shipset in tandem with other shipsets.
Well, then what if you provided two versions of the oxp - a "unique" and a "tandem" version"?

As I explained above it would require six versions not two, which is just too silly to contemplate.
I am thinking about this problem though, and may have a solution soon

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:41 pm**

I don't think there would be a problem with a version of Griff's that directly replaces the core models by being named identically, even though the models are very different. The current version of Neolite uses different models and replaces the core sets directly and I haven't seen any report of another OXP complaining because it's accidently like-shipped to a Neolite model and the texture doesn't fit...

Just to reiterate what I think would work in an ideal world.

For each of the retextures packs.

1 version labeled replace-core whose shipdata uses names that overwrite the core ships.
1 version labeled add-to-core whose shipdata uses unique names e.g neolite_adder, griff_adder smivs_adder etc. It doesn't need to contain any override.plists, but would need it's own demoships.plist and shipyard.plist.

The user then downloads one and only one replace-core set - their choice probably governed by which ship set they want a new jameson's cobra to be from. If that's all the variety they want they that's the end of it.

If they want more variety though they can download as many of the other shipsets add-to-core versions as they want, which will all sit nicely and not conflict with the replace-core set or each other.

Deepspace isalready set up like this, as is Shady Sungs. I've got permission to do the same for Neolite.

Griff's would need the current version without override.plists to be its add-to-core version. It's replace-core version would just need a shipdata using the core names and the model/texture files.

Smivs - although you would have 6 downloads to maintain you would still only have two Config set ups to maintain. One as it is currently, and a second with a shipdata with unique names with a matching demoships.plist and shipyard.plist. Personally I don't think that would be a problem, I could probably knock up the .plists in about 20 minutes.

As it stands it will be possible (once I've done a Neolite add-to-core version) to have all 5 installed, but it will need a bit of work on the part of the user to make it work. The current Smiv's would have to be the replace-core, and the add-to-core Deepsapce, Shady Sungs and forthcoming Neolite will sit nicely with that with no further tweaking. But Griff's would need the override.plists deleting. Plus the player if they don't want to start in the Smiv's cobby would need an override to their preferred version.

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:52 pm**

Ha, no it's not the producing or maintaing six versions that is the problem, it's the mind-numbing complexity/confusion that potential users would be hit with if they looked-up my shipset with a view to maybe using it. After five minutes of jellyfying their brains trying to work out which of the six they need, I expect they'd just give up and look elsewhere! Not good for business

I am in favour of what you are attempting here and don't want to be negative. I am thinking about two or three options as to how to best incorporate my shipset into your scheme and expect to make a decision very soon.

Posted: **Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:14 pm**

No worries Smivs.....to be honest I probably ought to properly test what I'm proposing to check for any unwanted side effects (I'm wondering what happens to an existing save game player ship if the core-replacement is changed - I'm thinking this could have some unwanted side effects with view positions and Griff's uniforms in particular).

I'll test it all this weekend and write the tutorial that would go with it and then peeps can make an informed decision.

Posted: **Tue Jan 24, 2012 6:28 am**

Capt. Murphy wrote:
I don't think there would be a problem with a version of Griff's that directly replaces the core models by being named identically, even though the models are very different. The current version of Neolite uses different models and replaces the core sets directly and I haven't seen any report of another OXP complaining because it's accidently like-shipped to a Neolite model and the texture doesn't fit...

Black Monks mangles its debtor ships badly if you've got replacement models for the core ships. All it's wanting to do is change the role from trader to debtor, so the gunship can identify which ships to chase, and add a ship script so the debtor will flee from the gunship, so all it needs is something like this and nothing more:-

Code: Select all

debtor_x = {
like_ship = "some-trader";
roles = "monks-debtor";
script = "monks-debtor.js";
}

But it includes completely unnecessary, assumed-to-be-correct information about the model and texture as well as the like_ship.

Posted: **Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:11 am**

Would this be a possible scenario.

Given distances between systems and galaxies, ship design and paint jobs would vary. This becomes even more true when we take galaxies (sectors) into account. So an interesting approach could be for ship sets to be more common in some galaxies than others. This would also enforce the feeling of having travelled great distances as the environment would change more, and even allow for a little "ships spotting"

Example.
Galaxy 1: Griff Ships 90%. Neolite 5%, Sungs 5% Smivs 1%.
Galaxy 2: Griff Ships 60%. Neolite 10, Sungs 10% Smivs 2%
Galaxy 3: Griff Ships 40%. Neolite 20%, Sungs 20% Smivs 5%.
Galaxy 4: Griff Ships 10%. Neolite 50%, Sungs 10% Smivs 10%
Galaxy 5: Griff Ships 5%. Neolite 80%, Sungs 5% Smivs 10%.
Galaxy 6: Griff Ships 10%. Neolite 50%, Sungs 2% Smivs 20%
Galaxy 7: Griff Ships 20%. Neolite 15%, Sungs 1% Smivs 50%.
Galaxy 8: Griff Ships 40%. Neolite 10%, Sungs 2% Smivs 20%

I know the percentages don't add up to 100%, not important, you get the idea anyway. Ships of a certain design tradition (ship set) are more common in one galaxy and as you move away, they become less common.

No favouritism intended in any way what so ever, it's just an example of a possible (preferably player configurable) scenario.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:05 pm**

Wildeblood wrote:
Capt. Murphy wrote:
Black Monks mangles its debtor ships badly if you've got replacement models for the core ships.

Thanks for the heads up - that's not very helpful is it, although looks to be an easy fix if someone were to have permission to do so.

Gimi - I like the idea, but I don't think it is easily doable without a little tweak to the scripting engine. roleWeights is currently read only. If it was read/write there may be scope to do this via script. Otherwise you are looking at manually changing plists or adding overrides when you change galaxy.

Posted: **Thu Jan 26, 2012 3:45 pm**

Smivs' tired old brain has finally finished cogitating, and decisions have been reached!

Smivs'Shipset v4.0 is now under development, and will have a different structure to its predecessors. I intend to continue to offer basic, standard definition and high definition versions as this arrangement has proved very popular. What I propose to do therefore is to offer this as a modular OXP. Users can select either 'Additional' or 'Replacement' versions, which (TaRaaaaa!) will either add my ships (to the default textures and/or other shipsets) or will be a straight replacement for the default textures. Once the user has decided which option to go for they will then be able to download the appropriate texture pack for their hardware. This arrangement should be straightforward and easy to use, and will be very flexible.
Needless to say v4.0 will also have lots of funky new features, with improved ships and textures, better lighting effects and.....well, wait and see

Posted: **Thu Jan 26, 2012 3:48 pm**

Smivs wrote:
SUsers can select either 'Additional' or 'Replacement' versions, which (TaRaaaaa!) will either add my ships (to the default textures and/or other shipsets) or will be a straight replacement for the default textures.

Posted: **Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:09 pm**

Eh, SUsers? I never invented that word!

Posted: **Thu Jan 26, 2012 8:04 pm**

Smivs wrote:
Eh, SUsers? I never invented that word!

<scratches head/> seems like my brain connect interface still has some kinks to iron out...

Posted: **Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:11 am**

Nice one Smivs.

Posted: **Sun Jan 29, 2012 11:08 am**

I've updated Neolite to 1.1 (http://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/Neolit ... eolite_1.1), with the Core set now having distinct 'replace' and 'addition' versions.

I'm proposing the following first draft of text to be added as a tutorial on the Wiki. It will have links to the appropriate wiki pages for the individual packs, and I think should be included in 'Category:Retextures OXPs' so a link to the tutorial appears on that page. The individual wiki pages for the various retexture packs should also link to it. It's written as the situation currently stands with Smivs 4.0 still in development and Griff's all in one in it's current format, but will of course be updated as and when there are any changes.

All comments welcome, I'm a bit sleep deprived as I write this so someone may well come up with something clearer.

How to install multiple retexture packs without conflicts.

There are currently 5 main retexture packs that retexture and/or remodel the native Oolite ships. They can be formatted to replace the native Oolite ships entirely, or to add the revamped ships in addition to the native Oolite ships.

If you install more than one retexture pack that replace the native Oolite ships, they will conflict and in general you will only see ships from one of the packs in game.

However you can install more than one pack that adds ships in addition to the native Oolite ships, or you can install one pack that replaces the native Oolite ship along with one or more that add ships. Note that in general the starting ship for a new Jameson will be the Cobra from the retexture pack that replaces the native Oolite ships.

Several of the retexture packs come in both 'addition' and 'replacement' versions to facilitate installing multiple retexture packs.

Smiv's Shipset 3.0 is currently only available as a 'replacement' version. Version 4.0 will be released as both 'replacement' and 'addition' versions.

Neolite Core 1.1 is available in both 'replacement' and 'addition' versions. Download and install the version you want following the instructions on the wiki page.

Deepspace Ships includes both 'replacement' and 'addition' versions in the same download. The 'addition' version files are included in an zip file included with the main download labelled 'non override config.zip'. To install this version you will need to extract the Config folder from this zip file and use it to replace the standard 'replacement' Config folder.

Shady Sungs is available in both 'replacement' and 'addition' versions (the addition version download is labelled 'Add-On'). Download and install the version you want.

Griff's all in one is technically an 'addition' version only, but includes Config files that suppress the native Oolite ships or any 'replacement' texture pack. The end-user can change this behaviour by deleting those Config files. Griff's also requires an additional OXP to make the starting ship for a new Jameson the Griff Cobra.

If you want Griff's to act as if it is a 'replacement' version, install the OXP along with one of the 'default_Jameson_is_griff_cobra' OXP's. Any other installed texture packs will have to be 'addition' versions to avoid conflicts.

If you want Griff's to work with another 'replacement' pack, install the OXP, navigate to it's Config folder, and delete the files 'shipdata-overrides.plist' and 'shipyard-overrides.plist'. The starting Jameson ship will be the Cobra from the other 'replacement' pack, and ships from both packs will be seen in game.

Oolite Bulletins

Retexture pack Reorganisation?

Re: Retexture pack Reorganisation?

Re: Retexture pack Reorganisation?

Re: Retexture pack Reorganisation?

Re: Retexture pack Reorganisation?

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Re: Retexture pack Reorganisation?