Oolite Bulletins

El Viejo wrote:

maik wrote:

As it doesn't have a license attached I'd hesitate to modify it. If johnsmith is still around: I'd be happy to modify it with your permission.

That is a little irksome... johnsmith hasn't posted for four years either.

Perhaps this should be the call to all active members with oxps to put a proper license in their oxp if not already there. Proper license is this:

This work is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 3.0
Unported License. To view a copy of this license, visit "http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-
nc-sa/3.0/'' or send a letter to Creative Commons, 171 Second Street, Suite 300, San
Francisco, California, 94105, USA.

and this:

Copyright <date and author> CC-by-nc-sa-3.0

Cmdr. Maegil wrote:

What are you afraid of, a MPAA-like law suit over abandonware?

Weeeeeeell... Some game producers have went into lawsuit rampages over old abandonware before (Dave Braben, EA and M$, I'm lookin' at you). It's unlikely that a lawyer attack would come from modding a fan made mod for an opensource game, but it can't be ruled out either.

Cmdr Wyvern wrote:

Cmdr. Maegil wrote:

What are you afraid of, a MPAA-like law suit over abandonware?

Weeeeeeell... Some game producers have went into lawsuit rampages over old abandonware before (Dave Braben, EA and M$, I'm lookin' at you). It's unlikely that a lawyer attack would come from modding a fan made mod for an opensource game, but it can't be ruled out either.

And let us not forget that there is something to be said for respecting other people's work. For that reason alone, one should obtain permission unless the license explicitly gives permission, and inform the author of your intentions even if it does.

Thargoid wrote:

...Some people may not actually want other people copying or deriving from their work, for any number of personal or practical reasons...

So, let's say someone has the entire community come up with major parts of an oxp(code, textures, models, etc.) and then they release it under restrictive licensing whereby nobody can copy parts of or derive from that work. How does this benefit the Oolite community? Where is the teamwork? How does this lay a foundation upon which to build a better oolite(via oxp)?

Personal achievement is one thing and the rights are still protected under the license I mentioned(Copyright <date and author> CC-by-nc-sa-3.0) and with caveats like I have in my oxp's to prevent other's derived works from breaking the either the original or other works with similar equipment names and variables, or to protect the integrity of a unique storyline/concept etc. But to prevent others(years later) from benefitting from that work and teamwork is selfish and I would say that anyone that employs such really restrictive licensing(or no license at all) that prevents others from ever using the work is not a team player and not worth contibuting effort and resources to in any projects they plan to release.

That said, there may be a few reasons for a really restrictive license. In a not for profit sharing teamwork community effort such as this, I can't think of any. Maybe someone could enlighten me.

Cmdr. Maegil wrote:

What are you afraid of, a MPAA-like law suit over abandonware?

Cmdr Wyvern wrote:

It's unlikely that a lawyer attack would come from modding a fan made mod for an opensource game, but it can't be ruled out either.

That would be surreal to say the very least. I think any judge would laugh in the plaintiff's face if given such a case (right before deciding it in the plaintiff's favour, as by the book).

Gimi wrote:

And let us not forget that there is something to be said for respecting other people's work. For that reason alone, one should obtain permission unless the license explicitly gives permission, and inform the author of your intentions even if it does.

I have no problem with attribution, it's only fair. I also never used this OXP.
But if it's between allowing it to needlessly go to waste because of legal inertia or doing the possible to contact the creator before updating or improving on his work (regardless of the search results), you can bet I'll always be on the shouting side of the barricade.

Thargoid wrote:

...The example that springs to mind is Sung's textures...

Oh, geez, here we go. I think it should be implicitly presumed that whatever work is posted for download here will not be paid for and is non-commercial. Nature of oolite oxps and all that.

Whatever the case, in my view, it is pointless to contribute unless my work can be used in some way as building blocks and foundations of future oolite oxps. This is, in fact a sandbox and this is what leads to better sandcastles.

Cheers Thargoid!

Cmdr. Maegil wrote:

Gimi wrote:

And let us not forget that there is something to be said for respecting other people's work. For that reason alone, one should obtain permission unless the license explicitly gives permission, and inform the author of your intentions even if it does.

I have no problem with attribution, it's only fair. I also never used this OXP.
But if it's between allowing it to needlessly go to waste because of legal inertia or doing the possible to contact the creator before updating or improving on his work (regardless of the search results), you can bet I'll always be on the shouting side of the barricade.

Sorry, this was meant as a general comment, not directed at you or anyone else. I never intended to imply anything in any direction. Again, sorry.

Note: This discussion should really be split off and appended to the sticky in discussion if possible. If not, separate thread will do.

Gimi wrote:

Cmdr. Maegil wrote:

Gimi wrote:

And let us not forget that there is something to be said for respecting other people's work. For that reason alone, one should obtain permission unless the license explicitly gives permission, and inform the author of your intentions even if it does.

I have no problem with attribution, it's only fair. I also never used this OXP.
But if it's between allowing it to needlessly go to waste because of legal inertia or doing the possible to contact the creator before updating or improving on his work (regardless of the search results), you can bet I'll always be on the shouting side of the barricade.

Sorry, this was meant as a general comment, not directed at you or anyone else. I never intended to imply anything in any direction. Again, sorry.

Note: This discussion should really be split off and appended to the sticky in discussion if possible. If not, separate thread will do.

I disagree. This is exactly the method for installing the ClearSkies.oxp since it has problems and no license. Anyone looking up this oxp name as a search here will find this viewtopic with all the relevant reason behind the problem.

Split and append if you must.

In this particular case I would suggest that as the existing OXP is effectively unusable in its released form, the technique that it attempts to use is 'trivial', and is also used by a number of other system altering OXP's and is well documented in the wiki, that it is in effect un-licensable. About the only thing that could be regarded as 'original work' now is the name and the couple of lines of blurb currently on the wiki. I wouldn't hesitate to fix the download and just call it clearskies_repacked.oxp

Or if really paranoid do as DaddyHoddy suggests and tweak the three planetinfo.plist settings it changes a tiny bit and release it as something like highcontrastuniverse.oxp with a matter of fact description - (This OXP increases ambient light levels and reduces background nebulae, making it easier to distinguish distant objects).

I didn`t mean to let the discussion explode that far.

Just installed that oxp but I don`t see a big difference. I would even appreciate it, if somebody would create an OXP, in which the contrast is even bigger.

LouisdeFuines wrote:

I didn`t mean to let the discussion explode that far.

Just installed that oxp but I don`t see a big difference. I would even appreciate it, if somebody would create an OXP, in which the contrast is even bigger.

I once created an OXP that tweaked the skies of two remote, adjacent systems. One I made the star further away, and the sky darker, with more stars than usual, but no nebulas at all - an old, old world, with dark, starry skies. The other I made the star closer, with brighter sky, obvious nebulas, and almost no stars - a newly formed planet, ravaged by frequent solar activity. I spent a whole afternoon getting them just right. I sent it to someone ^^^^, and the next day I asked, "What did you think of the skies, I spent a lot of time getting them just right?"

To which he replied, "I didn't notice your skies, I use System Redux, and that changes all the sky settings anyway."

Anyway, seek out a file called planetinfo.plist under oolite.app/Resources/Config/, copy it to Add-Ons/Config/ and tweak as much, or as little, as you like.

I have put together a replacement for this written in openstep rather than XML. It' an easy little script for a beginner, like me, to start with, and it should be easy for the player to adjust values to his or her liking. I will publish later today or tomorrow under the name Darkspace.oxp. Just need to write the read-me and pack it up. Murgh will be duly credited as the origin of the idea.

Wildeblood wrote:

LouisdeFuines wrote:

I didn`t mean to let the discussion explode that far.

Just installed that oxp but I don`t see a big difference. I would even appreciate it, if somebody would create an OXP, in which the contrast is even bigger.

I once created an OXP that tweaked the skies of two remote, adjacent systems. One I made the star further away, and the sky darker, with more stars than usual, but no nebulas at all - an old, old world, with dark, starry skies. The other I made the star closer, with brighter sky, obvious nebulas, and almost no stars - a newly formed planet, ravaged by frequent solar activity. I spent a whole afternoon getting them just right. I sent it to someone ^^^^, and the next day I asked, "What did you think of the skies, I spent a lot of time getting them just right?"

To which he replied, "I didn't notice your skies, I use System Redux, and that changes all the sky settings anyway."

Anyway, seek out a file called planetinfo.plist under oolite.app/Resources/Config/, copy it to Add-Ons/Config/ and tweak as much, or as little, as you like.

Maybe we need a overide_universal flag for such projects so OXPs that want to change these settings for individual systems are not overwritten by OXP's that include universal settings in the planetinfo. It would also be nice if the log file reported if there are multiple OXP's with universal settings and report which one 'won'.