Oolite Bulletins

Commander McLane wrote:

I think it has to be integrated with the Fuel Collector. That makes sense for two reasons: first, it's a similar functionality, and in the end you'll have to scoop the cargo anyway. And second, from a scripting perspective, the Fuel Collector as it is now is also triggered by proximity to a derelict ship. If we want another functionality triggered also be proximity, the two of them have to play nice with each other.

I tried the fuel collector last night, after you released your updated version. I have to say that I think it is one of the most blatant cheating OXPs there is. It's silly enough that in the core game you can fly about forever, without using any fuel whatsoever, until you hyperspace to a different system. It's irritating that the core game allows the cheat of "scooping" fuel from stars for those players who are too cheap to pay for it, when it's literally cheaper than dirt (compare the price of 1ly of fuel versus 1t of ore). But, the idea that just flying about aimlessly should result in fuel tanks filling, rather than emptying, is ineffably silly.

Wildeblood wrote:

It's irritating that the core game allows the cheat of "scooping" fuel from stars for those players who are too cheap to pay for it, when it's literally cheaper than dirt (compare the price of 1ly of fuel versus 1t of ore). But, the idea that just flying about aimlessly should result in fuel tanks filling, rather than emptying, is ineffably silly.

Did you ever play Elite?

Wildeblood wrote:

It's silly enough that in the core game you can fly about forever, without using any fuel whatsoever, until you hyperspace to a different system.

It's a game about (mostly) dogfighting in space, not fuel management in space. It's silly that you can be a space merchant and not have to fill in customs declarations and file tax returns, too. Vive la bêtise!

Wildeblood wrote:

It's irritating that the core game allows the cheat of "scooping" fuel from stars for those players who are too cheap to pay for it

That does sort of ignore the (minor) peril involved – and the fact that sometimes you might want, or need, to avoid the main stations. I'm not sure that anyone goes sunskimming to save money.

I agree, however, that having your fuel tanks fill up just by flying around does seem a bit OTT, and it's not something I would have in my own game. But looting fuel off a derelict does at least make the player work for it.

Wildeblood wrote:

I tried the fuel collector last night, after you released your updated version. I have to say that I think it is one of the most blatant cheating OXPs there is. It's silly enough that in the core game you can fly about forever, without using any fuel whatsoever, until you hyperspace to a different system. It's irritating that the core game allows the cheat of "scooping" fuel from stars for those players who are too cheap to pay for it, when it's literally cheaper than dirt (compare the price of 1ly of fuel versus 1t of ore). But, the idea that just flying about aimlessly should result in fuel tanks filling, rather than emptying, is ineffably silly.

Whoa there!

Quirium fuel which is what is used to open a wormhole is what requires to you "burn" fuel. There is no fuel burnt in normal (non-injector flight) because the handwavium internal drive that creates the inertialess flight doesn't use any of the quirium fuel to move the ship through normal space.

Since it has been established in Canon (Dark Wheel and the Flight Manual) that the Fuel Scoop is a device that takes the small amounts of quirium present in stellar gases and converts into fuel - this is the way it has always been - All the fuel collector does is logically progress the fact that in system space some of these Stellar gases are also present in small quantities and therefore quirium is also present in very tiny quantities, which is why you need to fly around at full chat for a long time to scoop any additional fuel... (I generally use it for scooping from derelicts though)

Trust me as an ex-Frontier player a game stops being fun when after an hour of real time but days of game time at 10,000x TAF just before you arrive at station Aegis your ship runs out of fuel and you drift off into the void never to be seen again...

Disembodied wrote:

Wildeblood wrote:

It's silly enough that in the core game you can fly about forever, without using any fuel whatsoever, until you hyperspace to a different system.

It's a game about (mostly) dogfighting in space, not fuel management in space. It's silly that you can be a space merchant and not have to fill in customs declarations and file tax returns, too.

Did you see my post from two days ago?

Customs Control

Wildeblood wrote:

Did you see my post from two days ago?

Customs Control

As long as it doesn't add a form-filling simulator, I'm in favour ...

Thanks Commander McLane,

Commander McLane wrote:

Okay, I'm going to have a look into this and come up with something. It's not going to be a get-rich-quick device, because I find balance important, but it's going to add another nice flavour to the game.

I think it has to be integrated with the Fuel Collector. That makes sense for two reasons: first, it's a similar functionality, and in the end you'll have to scoop the cargo anyway. And second, from a scripting perspective, the Fuel Collector as it is now is also triggered by proximity to a derelict ship. If we want another functionality triggered also be proximity, the two of them have to play nice with each other.

I'm thinking about modifying the Fuel Collector script. When you get close to a derelict, your ship's computer screen would pop up and give you a choice of either trying to extract cargo or to extract fuel (maybe there are other possible choices as well?). After each extraction process there is a certain chance of the derelict to blow up. So in some cases you may be able to extract all its contents (cargo first and fuel later, or vice versa). But in other cases the derelict will not survive the tampering and you only keep what you got first. I think that's fair. Even now extracting fuel can cause the derelict to blow up sometimes.

I think another PM to Frame is due.

As I said this could be very useful to me in any form you make and I'm also intriged by the "others possibly choices" Thanks Again and please let me know!
slomoe

slomoe wrote:

As I said this could be very useful to me in any form you make and I'm also intriged by the "others possibly choices" Thanks Again and please let me know!

I am open to suggestions as to the other choices. One thing I came up with is salvaging unused missiles if you happen to have a free pylon. Perhaps you have more ideas?

I won't include the possibility of hacking into the other guy's account and fill your pockets with cash, though.

Damn no free credits Just kidding One thing I always wondered about was if you popped open a cargo bay what would you find besides station bought cargopods? How about spare equipment, besides missles. Don't get me wrong missles are great in fact if you have the weapons type oxp installed there is quite a selection. Like something you may not have, extra energy unit, military shields, other ships equipment . I'm not even sure that could work, but I was reading thur some past posts and actually had my own treasuroid encounter so possibly something above and beyond, unexpected. How about a chance for a mini mission, something they were doing when the unforseen happened and you have the choice to finish thier mission! maybe a person in static containment or important documents to be taken to a near system who knows it could open up lots of choices thanks again C McL
slomoe

Hmmm...

what if the derelict has converted some of its cargo space to cabins and you overriding the cargo locks also opens up the cabins (which had self sealed against the vacuum as part of emergency protocols for passengers unable to get to an escape pod.

Tumbling bodies and a murder charge - go straight to Fugitive, do not pass go, do not collect 200Cr...

don't like the missiles idea, it just seems that scooping things and dumping them in a cargo hold/fuel tank is doable, but scooping a missile then correctly moving it, aligning it and hooking it up to a pylon would not be doable outside of a fitting yard.
Like DH's idea, but instead of killing them what about if you got a nice juicy reward for saving civilians from a slow and awful death? i'd thik the chances of finding people should be very low tho.

Killer Wolf wrote:

don't like the missiles idea, it just seems that scooping things and dumping them in a cargo hold/fuel tank is doable, but scooping a missile then correctly moving it, aligning it and hooking it up to a pylon would not be doable outside of a fitting yard.

I though about that as well, and there is indeed the question how a missile would get from your scoops and cargo bay to your pylons. On the other hand, scoopable missiles already exist in both Cargo & Wrecks.oxp and Pods.oxp.

Killer Wolf wrote:

DaddyHoggy wrote:

what if the derelict has converted some of its cargo space to cabins and you overriding the cargo locks also opens up the cabins (which had self sealed against the vacuum as part of emergency protocols for passengers unable to get to an escape pod.

Tumbling bodies and a murder charge - go straight to Fugitive, do not pass go, do not collect 200Cr...

Like DH's idea, but instead of killing them what about if you got a nice juicy reward for saving civilians from a slow and awful death? i'd thik the chances of finding people should be very low tho.

Hmm. I always assumed that—just like the cockpit—also a passenger berth is effectively an escape pod. There must be a reason why it takes up 5t of cargo space, after all. So in case of disabling the ship it should get ejected as well. But of course the mechanism could be jammed in some cases. Bad for the passenger.

I therefore agree that the chance should be very low. What happens then could perhaps depend on your own ship. If you have an empty passenger berth, you could attempt to transfer the passenger to it (just throwing ideas around; I have no idea whether this is even possible scripting-wise), thereby saving their life. This would be a tricky procedure, and the derelict would most probably not survive it. In other words: you'd have to decide, do I save the passenger and my conscience, or do I loot the cargo and doom the passenger?

If you have no free berth, a couple of different things could happen. Either your hacking of the ship frees the jammed escape pod, happily launching it and destroying the derelict in the process. Or the passenger dies like DH suggested.

Oh, and by the way: I have Frame's go-ahead for this, so I can start with the serious scripting.

i don't think the passenger berth transfer should happen, like you say it should be treat as an escape pod - scooped, stored, cashed in on docking. the choice between cargo and rescue is good, tho i guess in "real life" the reward/insurance payout/whatever would/should outstrip any/most cargo retrieval values.

How about a chance of picking up an occasional "furry friend"?

Disembodied wrote:

How about a chance of picking up an occasional "furry friend"?

Gets my vote!

Was thinking about the cabins - self contained - bigger than an escape pod - no propulsion - sometimes they're jettisoned and the hatch/door opens...

They'd make a nice little collection of additional models that could be ejected with the debris field on ships that had enough cargo space to carry them...