Oolite Bulletins

Cody wrote:

I definitely think the larger stations (Dodo and Ico) should rotate slower - but I have mixed feelings about the more common Coriolis. Slower rotation looks better, for sure, but learning to dock at traditional rotation speed is a useful skill. Personally, I have Griff's three stations rotating at different speeds - and the hermit should also rotate.

The extrapolation of this would suggest that the Octahedron Stations would rotate faster than the Coriolis and that the Tetrahedron would spin the fastest of all stations . I thought it sounded daft even as I wrote it...but the rewards from selling high priced tonnage at these smaller Stations can be quiet coffer filling which to me (in addition to all the bandits in the low TL systems) might actually be sauce for the goose and the frustration/appeal of manual docking , viz a viz the original Elite would be maintained to some degree.

Redspear wrote:

If we wanted to be be really faithful to Elite we could remove the docking buoy. That's what made it difficult for me all those years ago: not the rotation, the lining up. However, I'm not suggeting that we do that.

For me, the only appeal to keeping the higher rotation would be to give beginners that same thrill I had way back when, however, it would be in a different climate now and I suspect that the reward to frustration ratio would have shifted significantly...

I vote for slowing them down. We don't do real scale in Oolite for good reason but anything that adds to the illusion of it is likely a good thing in my book.
For hermits, I'm not sure if I prefer them being stationary; maybe a very slow rotation for them

This. Games have moved on, what used to be a badge of honour is more likely to be a frustration to new players today.

Very much liking what I'm reading so far about the new changes. thanks cim & team

Also this

earl sleek wrote:

This. Games have moved on, what used to be a badge of honour is more likely to be a frustration to new players today.

Moving on != improvement. There's nothing wrong with being frustrated, it's not much of a challenge to start with - after a few crashes you can learn to dock with speed redlining. And if you don't like docking buy a docking computer after scraping in your first few trade runs - it makes buying and using the DC even more satisfying (sidebar - Aussie kids are being banned from playground games because they can't stand losing - that's what happens when you don't frustrate people). Maybe we should just put an achievement system in to inspire them (I'm joking - I hate achievements with the intensity of a military laser).

Redspear wrote:

I vote for slowing them down. We don't do real scale in Oolite for good reason but anything that adds to the illusion of it is likely a good thing in my book.

This.

Rotational speed according to size, in my book.

Redspear wrote:

If we wanted to be be really faithful to Elite we could remove the docking buoy. That's what made it difficult for me all those years ago: not the rotation, the lining up. However, I'm not suggeting that we do that.

For me, the only appeal to keeping the higher rotation would be to give beginners that same thrill I had way back when, however, it would be in a different climate now and I suspect that the reward to frustration ratio would have shifted significantly...

I vote for slowing them down. We don't do real scale in Oolite for good reason but anything that adds to the illusion of it is likely a good thing in my book.

+1 from me. There's very little practical difference between how hard it is to dock in a slowly rotating station or in a more rapidly rotating one, unless the speed differences are very large. Like Redspear says, it's getting lined up that's the trick: once you've done that, matching the rotation is the easy part. The station rotation is about aesthetics, not about difficulty, I think: a slowly rotating station looks ponderous and massive and gives the game a sense of scale and grandeur.

Redspear wrote:

For hermits, I'm not sure if I prefer them being stationary; maybe a very slow rotation for them

I'd go with this - again, I don't think this would make it harder to dock with a Hermit, as long as the axis of rotation was centred on the docking bay. It might look harder, but with a hexagonal docking port it shouldn't be necessary for a player in a standard ship to do anything other than line up properly: I don't think they'd have to match the rotation at all.

Just had a thought - how hard would it be to make Rock Hermits tumble (ie. rotate very slowly in all three axes like an asteroid)? That would seriously ramp up the sweat factor - I'd love to try docking with one!

The main problem with that would be for NPC dockings or use of Docking Computers at normal speed (as opposed to Shift-C) but I can't remember the last time I saw anyone else dock at a Hermit. Plenty leaving, though - and usually pretty angry too.

As for Docking Computers, maybe having them not work at Hermits would be an interesting wrinkle. Tumbling target, no DCs, ramp up/down the prices inside to make it worthwhile...

...just a thought.

Capt. Reynolds wrote:

Just had a thought - how hard would it be to make Rock Hermits tumble (ie. rotate very slowly in all three axes like an asteroid)? That would seriously ramp up the sweat factor - I'd love to try docking with one!

It wouldn't be hard to make them tumble, but I don't think this should be standard. One of the first things anyone would do, if they're going to live inside a hollow asteroid - especially if they're going to be launching and docking themselves, as asteroid miners do - is to correct the tumble, and maybe give it a single-axis spin, if they want cheap gravity. Docking with a tumbling target would be a great challenge for some sort of mission, but I wouldn't want to see it as a routine feature (plus, too, it would really screw up the indigenous NPCs ...).

Capt. Reynolds wrote:

Hermits would be an interesting wrinkle. Tumbling target, no DCs, ramp up/down the prices inside to make it worthwhile...

Yes that would make docking fun. Disagree about changing the prices, they're already good places to buy and sell. If there are a few hermits in a system, the price differentials are good enough to make profits with in-system trading between them and the main station/s.

Disembodied wrote:

... but with a hexagonal docking port it shouldn't be necessary for a player in a standard ship to do anything other than line up properly...

Griff's hermits do have a docking slot inside the hexagonal tunnel - but hermits should definitely rotate.

Maybe the hermits should rotate contra-wise.

However, if they do rotate, it will be more difficult to dock at torus speed.

Tricky wrote:

... if they do rotate, it will be more difficult to dock at torus speed.

Right good fun, is that... especially when they are rotating.

Disembodied wrote:

Redspear wrote:

If we wanted to be be really faithful to Elite we could remove the docking buoy. That's what made it difficult for me all those years ago: not the rotation, the lining up. However, I'm not suggeting that we do that.

+1 from me. There's very little practical difference between how hard it is to dock in a slowly rotating station or in a more rapidly rotating one, unless the speed differences are very large. Like Redspear says, it's getting lined up that's the trick: once you've done that, matching the rotation is the easy part. The station rotation is about aesthetics, not about difficulty, I think: a slowly rotating station looks ponderous and massive and gives the game a sense of scale and grandeur.

Redspear wrote:

For hermits, I'm not sure if I prefer them being stationary; maybe a very slow rotation for them

I'd go with this - again, I don't think this would make it harder to dock with a Hermit, as long as the axis of rotation was centred on the docking bay. It might look harder, but with a hexagonal docking port it shouldn't be necessary for a player in a standard ship to do anything other than line up properly: I don't think they'd have to match the rotation at all.

+1 from me as well

Redspear wrote:

If we wanted to be be really faithful to Elite we could remove the docking buoy.

Not 100% about this, but I think in vanilla Oolite there isn't a buoy for hermits. The buoy gets added by the Rock Hermit Locator OXP.

JazHaz wrote:

Not 100% about this, but I think in vanilla Oolite there isn't a buoy for hermits. The buoy gets added by the Rock Hermit Locator OXP.

<nods>

Cody wrote:

I definitely think the larger stations (Dodo and Ico) should rotate slower - but I have mixed feelings about the more common Coriolis.

Errrm. All stations have equal size (1000 m diameter).

Apart from that, I'm also for slowing down the rotation, because it does indeed enhance the illusion of size.

As a matter of fact, I've made an OXP to that effect: [wiki]Stationrotation OXP[/wiki]. It also makes some of the stations rotate in the opposite direction.

I'm less certain about the Rock Hermit, though. But that may mainly be due to me not being used to have them rotate.