RFC: Fancy classics

[wackyman465]

Wow. Just wow. These are all amazing.

[pagroove]

I like them all, really. They are good and the textures also. Yeah a few days without the BB is good for the creativity

[ZygoUgo]

Hi Simon, firstly damned fine job on that shuttle, the winged one is now my favourite
Not sure about your second remake/update of the adder, my reason being that it isn't a ship that I would expect to look mean and expensive. Not sure if I'm a fan of every ship looking like it's ready to pounce, especially if it's a relatively harmless trader/industrial vehicle. Also the first versions textures looked more metallic, I think because they were slightly lighter.

By Nannook man you're currently unstoppable!

[DaddyHoggy]

@Simon B - Fabulous! Well done that man - it's like watching the old mini become the new mini (although that's a bad example - I don't like the new mini) erm, let me try again - The Ford Escort becomes the Ford Focus. It's like things have moved on - technology - styling and you've captured that transition.

Brill, look forward to seeing them mixing it up with their old dinosaur pre-cursors.

[Simon B]

Hi Simon, firstly damned fine job on that shuttle, the winged one is now my favourite :D
Not sure about your second remake/update of the adder, my reason being that it isn't a ship that I would expect to look mean and expensive. Not sure if I'm a fan of every ship looking like it's ready to pounce, especially if it's a relatively harmless trader/industrial vehicle. Also the first versions textures looked more metallic, I think because they were slightly lighter.

By Nannook man you're currently unstoppable! :D

I see your point - where I saw a Lotus or a Lamboughini, you saw a Ford Falcon Stationwagon?

The Adder is one of those that is hard to stop fiddling - so it is likely there will be several versions ... and colors. Probably worth doing a ford-version too.

I too have been concerned that the ships have been getting darker. Mostly it's the fault of all the extra shadows I've been putting in. Compare these recent efforts to that first Python... but also bear in mind that the game seems to enhance lighter shades, so the Python may turn out to be too light.

The texture for the new adder is actually lighter than the previous attempt. The difference in rendering comes from adding a slight greenish specular effect - which will be tightened in the actual game.

Something like this:

(Thanks Griff).

[Simon B]

The Neolite OXP alpha-2 is out. It contains all the models showcased above, and I've included the wavefront files as well, so modellers can see what I've done and otherwise play.

Caveat: The plists contain entries for which there are currently no ships - which means it will break anything which calls such a ship by name. Like your saved game or opening screen (no cobra models).

The adder is there so you can actually start a new Jameson... he just has to downgrade his ship or fly a big question mark about.

[Screet]

And "Constrictor" is correct. The ship sillouette is closest of all of them to the classic, and the color scheme is the same - but it's not a ship people see much of - and not for long.

That's true, even with RS it's a very rare sighting (and gave me much better fights than the one from the mission)...but I guess everyone who ever played elite has that model burnt into his mind

Sidewinder departs most from the classic. The fighters are not ships you'd normally get a good look at: I was surprised to discover the actual shape of some of them.

Really? I do like to shoot from distance, but as soon as front and aft laser are hot, I go in (side lasers are powerful against capital ships, but I've still got difficulties with fighters before I switched to the GriffBoa)...and when I go in, I typically get so close that I fly in the exhaust of the pursued craft...then I don't see much of the model, but during the approach to get there, I do...guess that's big part of the fun, seeing things close up.

For the asp it's that the old design with it's plates marks "the asp" for me, and this identification is practically gone in the newer version.

Don't be fooled - the neolite concept has the same profile side-on and only has slightly flattened sides.

The pentagonal shapes are still there - though not as obvious. They were very difficult to keep. But look at the rear view - I think you'd recognize that.

Yes, the outside works, as soon as one overlooks the inset front/aft. It's from topside, though, that the easy to recognize plate went away - however this only makes it more difficult to instantly understand it's the new asp, but as I said, even when they are a bit more different for me, those ships look great!!!

You are right that the overall x-sections of the fighters is smaller - this is due to the narrow wings.

...and I like that, as it enhances things!

An example - the asp bottom view strongly emphasises the bottom vents - which are very small otherwise. There is an optical illusion in that model: in the side profile, the bottom looks (to some) like it has a kink in it. It's not there.

I've been trying to limit these effects - but some, like the bump-mapped grills, are deliberate.

This might even be an idea for further modelling: a ship that deliberately tries to look like something else by such means, thus making it more difficult to identify the real threat.

In general, modellers have a take-it-or-leave-it attitude to the results. It's their oxp after all.

For Neolites I want to be different - the result, I hope, is not to be "my" oxp at all, but "ours".

Not everyone will be equally happy with everything - I'm sure there are classic ships you don't like(?) - hopefully the resulting discussion will help further define the style of the game. FOSS projects are an ongoing negotiation - nothing is set in stone - a constant exchange of ideas is essential. So I want to thank you and the others for taking part.

Yeah...and that's the big thing of this game: the variability of the game together with the possibility to talk with all those people involved. Also very good for bug hunting - commercial developers often do not want such things, as they don't bring in further profit. Things are very different here...and not only in this fine thread. I'm glad though, that you bring these questions to the public this early, it's much fun and interesting to see how things develop! Thanks for chosing this way, and after seeing all those new ideas, I'm /really/ looking forward to adding them to my AddOn folder!

Screet

[ovvldc]

Something like this:

Griff made a gorgeous model there. Somehow reminds me of the Brotherhood of Steel though...

-Oscar

[ZygoUgo]

I see your point - where I saw a Lotus or a Lamboughini, you saw a Ford Falcon Stationwagon

For budget reasons, don't really expect anyone to agree with me on that.
I like objects to reflect unique personalities I guess, it's kind of how I've always drawn.
It's cool to be able to watch you developing these, and the style that's growing with it, don't think I've seen any other space vessels with the 'flavour' you use!

Out of the larger vessel's, which really work for me, my favourite is actually the Boa, what with you saying you weren't sure about it.
Will the cabin part be scripted as an escape vessel? I'm presuming so.
Perhaps it could become its own fighter vessel in desperate moments, albiet trading sheild for maneuverability, that's probably not possible though, how would you rejoin them?

[Simon B]

There is a cool trick

May I suggest the Skinner’s Den thread? ;-)

You may ... I went I read I posted. Thanx.

[Simon B]

It's cool to be able to watch you developing these, and the style that's growing with it, don't think I've seen any other space vessels with the 'flavour' you use!

Interesting that I get accused of "originality" when self-consciously doing deriverative work ;) ... still, there's no point repeating what someone else is already good at.

Out of the larger vessel's, which really work for me, my favourite is actually the Boa, what with you saying you weren't sure about it.

Well - it departs considerably from the base model ... those early ships are from before I learned to convert the source models into obj files: I had to build them from scratch.

80s coders were more interested in gameplay that special effects - for obvious reasons - and it turns out that most of the core ships are a very simple build: I could probably hand-code them.

Will the cabin part be scripted as an escape vessel? I'm presuming so.

Yes - that's the idea.

Ahruman has pointed the way but it hasn't been scripted ... yet.

If someone would like to do it first I'll be happy to credit them.

Anybody?

[Simon B]

Sidewinder - second variety
... it struck me that it is the big triangles which give the sidewinder it's distinctive shape - if these are indicative of large, body-centered, delta-wings, then I can cut out the center triangles and fill the space with cabin and engins ... which puts the blunt-nose back.

I was originally thinking of the A10(?) Warthog, but if I use longer engines and turn the wings up at the tips, I get the opposite of the Gecko. Look:


... texture is unfinished - colors are blocked in to show the idea only. I'll update this pic if people like the model.

Before anyone says that this looks nothing like the core ship, take another look in the top right ... I put the official sidewinder wireframe around the model.

I used the same trick on the nose as I did for the, yes, Constrictor (well done those people who guessed that one). The round bits can be smoothed in the game - there are five models in the pic (if you count the gun and its cable) but I intend to combine them for production.

Oh, and a nod to [https://bb.oolite.space/viewtopic.php?t=5550]Scarecrow[/url] for providing the idea...


Since the texture is a tad primitive, I merged in the gun model to ive it a bit of interest. I'm thinking of using seperate gun models on chosen ships - and the model you see is the one that is likely.

Note the leopard cam - compare with the mamba earlier Griff.
Is the snow-cam over metal better?

[Selezen]

Wow. That's about it. Wow. Personally I think those models are amazing, Simon. They definitely bring a new dimension to the old ships, being new and fresh and detailed but retaining a shadow of the original designs.

Superb work, sir! I salute you!

[another_commander]

New Gecko + New Sidewinder = The Win.

[Griff]

Wow, everytime you open this thread, there's extra Amaze!
Sorry, if i sounded rude going on about the cowprint earlier, unpacking box after box of gateway computers hs given me bovine fear - the texture looks lovely on that latest ship though - have you seen Ahruman's animated shader example he's just posted? - we should work that into the game - i had a krait shader that would darken the hull colours and fake a reflection on it - it make it had to spot and a bit invisible - i wonder if i could combine ahrumans shader with that so the ship looks like it's being eaten away?

Are you keeping copies of your textures with all the elements on seperate layers, decals, different ares of paint colours 'cos with the new shader examples we can randomise all these, or colour mothers & escorts with the same scheme (i think with the group ID binding?)

the first green cobra is the original texture, the pink one is being recoloured by the shader. if you've flattened everything into one layer, it's no problem, we can just paint out rough single channel 'masks' into another image for the shader to use to control the effect,