Refugee Adders (Murgh .oxp)

[Old Murgh]

Apologies... not my point. My point is me! I'm in a cobra MkIII with some or all of the goodies outlined above. How many of these poor chaps can I save? How many can I keep remLocked in my cargo hold? How many come with masks already? Can I just provide masks for 2? How many can I keep alive and breathing in my living quarters? Is there a chance my passenger will be willing to share his/her berth... etc., etc., etc.

What is the absolute maximum I can take - and for how long..., and what are the effects when the limits are exceeded (what effect does less oxygen have on my piloting capabilities, etc.)

Right. I should think a good bunch manage to get on masks, but you will arrive too late to provide any with yours
While providing small RemLok survivors for saving shouldn't be hard, having them accounted in the hold (without ending up with each counting as 1t slave) is a challenge. Maybe a commodity must be created and a different weight like those measured in kg can be applied. Then you would fit a reasonable number into a hold.

By the way, just downloaded your 2005 OXP and am trying it out. Is this the first ever space-ship with a revolving backside? Using Long Range Scanner, spotted it in Corporate Riredi and scooted over, just in time to follow it through the witchspace tunnel to anarchic Eninre where it has just spent some 20 minutes waltzing around the witchspace beacon in a seeming state of febrile funque. After another hour it had made its way over to the Aegis. But it then overshot it by 150km and is now heading towards the sun!

I think it's the second revolver as it closely followed Giles' Weeviloid that showed us how to do it.

It's a melancholy bewildered journey you describe but it sounds peaceful, –they're not being harmed? The theory that cops could either attack or protect them should be part of the gamble.

More ideas for the base oxp:
*Restrict the ships to certain systems or routes, rather than appearing indiscriminately.
*GNN messages about refugees, heralding a massive move of refugee ships from say Laenin to Xexedi, or some such.
*Does the AI need tweaking? Cim rejigged the AI's available back in v.1.80 & 1.82... there is now rather more choice...
It might now be possible to get it to sunskim or refuel at Rock Hermits in dangerous systems and only land at the safer ones...
*Interraction with Broadcast.comms - asking for help/protection, or offering help/protection

And also get the pirate slave-trader versions to act as such too...

The system restrictions and distress calls should be on the cards for the first round. I like that they would form a group exodus, that ought to make the news.

Yes, I have a feeling that old legacy script isn't doing everything it used to anymore. Still dreading what it will require to learn how to do many of these things in javascript. The indoor season is soon at an end, so maybe it's next winter's project.

[Cholmondely]

The Vanilla game's Passenger Berth does not transport people who are classified as slaves on arrival.

Phkb's GalCop Missions features much new equipment including:

Patient Transport Module
Mass Passenger Transport Module

These might just be named dummies (in which case they transport neither passengers nor slaves), or there may be more to them.

See Hiran's comprehensive "outputdir" (Oolite Known Universe) - which lists all equipment in Oolite oxz's up to a few month's ago, and with details which you probably know enough to understand (I don't):

Equipment Patient Transport Module

A self-contained medical ward for transporting critically ill patients.
Identifier EQ_GCM_PATIENT_TRANSPORT
Name Patient Transport Module
Cost 1 deci-credits (divide by 10 to get credits)
Tech Level 0 (available on 1+)
Expansion GalCop Missions
Features
available_to_NPCs no
available_to_all yes
available_to_player yes
condition_script galcopbb_conditions.js
damage_probability 2.0
installation_time 1.0
portable_between_ships yes
requires_cargo_space 5
script_info {equipment_space=0.0;equipment_weight=8.0;}
visible yes

Equipment Mass Passenger Transport Module

Basic passenger transport module for housing up to 50 passengers.
Identifier EQ_GCM_PASSENGER_TRANSPORT
Name Mass Passenger Transport Module
Cost 1 deci-credits (divide by 10 to get credits)
Tech Level 0 (available on 1+)
Expansion GalCop Missions
Features
available_to_NPCs no
available_to_all yes
available_to_player yes
condition_script galcopbb_conditions.js
damage_probability 0.0
installation_time 1.0
portable_between_ships yes
requires_cargo_space 10
script_info {equipment_space=0.0;equipment_weight=8.0;}
visible yes

A list of equipment available through oxp in the Oolite game is now available here - it does not include the 613 different versions of dummy, etc.

[Old Murgh]

These might just be named dummies (in which case they transport neither passengers nor slaves), or there may be more to them.

See Hiran's comprehensive "outputdir" (Oolite Known Universe) - which lists all equipment in Oolite oxz's up to a few month's ago, and with details which you probably know enough to understand (I don't):

Interesting. I'll see if I do understand enough and these provide something adaptable.

[phkb]

Phkb's GalCop Missions features much new equipment including:

Patient Transport Module
Mass Passenger Transport Module

It's worth noting that both those items are related to specific missions, and aren't really usable for anything else. Once the mission is completed (success or failure), the equipment items are removed.

[Cholmondely]

Phkb's GalCop Missions features much new equipment including:

Patient Transport Module
Mass Passenger Transport Module

It's worth noting that both those items are related to specific missions, and aren't really usable for anything else. Once the mission is completed (success or failure), the equipment items are removed.

Aaah! But my quote was in response to this (edited to give context):

I'm in a Cobra MkIII containing some or all of the goodies outlined above (Passenger Berths, Escape Pod, Living Quarters, Cargo Hold, remLock masks...). How many of these poor chaps from your wrecked refugee adder can I save? How many can I keep remLocked in my cargo hold? How many come with masks already? Can I just provide masks for 2? How many can I keep alive and breathing in my living quarters? Is there a chance my passenger will be willing to share his/her berth... etc., etc., etc.

What is the absolute maximum I can take - and for how long..., and what are the effects when the limits are exceeded (what effect does less oxygen have on my piloting capabilities, etc.)

Right. I should think a good bunch manage to get on masks, but you will arrive too late to provide any with yours
While providing small RemLok survivors for saving shouldn't be hard, having them accounted in the hold (without ending up with each counting as 1t slave) is a challenge. Maybe a commodity must be created and a different weight like those measured in kg can be applied. Then you would fit a reasonable number into a hold.

Although, thinking further, your Escape Pod Slave Fix should also sort out enslavement issues...

[Cholmondely]

Further musings on stuffing adderless refugees into a Cobra cargo hold.

Size of Regular Adder: 30m×8m×45m - 2 crew, 2TC cargo, no cargo bay extension
Size of Stretch Adder: 30m×8m×115m - ? crew, 15TC cargo, no cargo bay extension
The space expansion raises the potential passenger and cargo capacity a great deal, comfortably fitting 70 humanoids. The highest recorded number of passengers, is 128, but those were undoubtedly inhumane conditions.

Size of Cobra Mk.3: 130m×30m×65m - 2 crew, 20TC cargo, 15TC extension

Issues:
1) Do the 70-128 chaps and chapettes squeeze into the 15TC volume cargo bay? Or is the 15TC in addition to the 70 comfortable humanoids?

If the first, they can definitely be fitted into my empty cobra hold. If the second, we need the scour the myriad opinions of the volume of a tonne cannister. One presumes that the 15TC is either the entire area (important datum for slavers squeezing in slave containers), or the cargo of the refugees - and a guide to detritus if the adder disintegrates.

2) Crew on Stretch Adder: The Martin engine might require additional engineers with wind-up keys and jars of lubricating oil to keep it spinning!

[Old Murgh]

Further musings on stuffing adderless refugees into a Cobra cargo hold.

Size of Regular Adder: 30m×8m×45m - 2 crew, 2TC cargo, no cargo bay extension
Size of Stretch Adder: 30m×8m×115m - ? crew, 15TC cargo, no cargo bay extension
The space expansion raises the potential passenger and cargo capacity a great deal, comfortably fitting 70 humanoids. The highest recorded number of passengers, is 128, but those were undoubtedly inhumane conditions.

Size of Cobra Mk.3: 130m×30m×65m - 2 crew, 20TC cargo, 15TC extension

Issues:
1) Do the 70-128 chaps and chapettes squeeze into the 15TC volume cargo bay? Or is the 15TC in addition to the 70 comfortable humanoids?

If the first, they can definitely be fitted into my empty cobra hold. If the second, we need the scour the myriad opinions of the volume of a tonne cannister. One presumes that the 15TC is either the entire area (important datum for slavers squeezing in slave containers), or the cargo of the refugees - and a guide to detritus if the adder disintegrates.

2) Crew on Stretch Adder: The Martin engine might require additional engineers with wind-up keys and jars of lubricating oil to keep it spinning!

12 years on the comfortably fitting 70 feels a bit much. I wouldn't have used the word comfortable today. Back then I took pride in being able to travel rough.

We must assume every available inch has been exploited, no additional expansion. On the other hand, I imagine some sardine arrangement can be made to fit 10 reclined immigrants into 1t containers, so that could set the limit to 150 people.

Yes, I don't think you can get around a little crew constantly needed to keep the primitive mechanics going. Wind-up, eh?

[Old Murgh]

*Does the AI need tweaking? Cim rejigged the AI's available back in v.1.80 & 1.82... there is now rather more choice...
It might now be possible to get it to sunskim or refuel at Rock Hermits in dangerous systems and only land at the safer ones...
*Interraction with Broadcast.comms - asking for help/protection, or offering help/protection

And also get the pirate slave-trader versions to act as such too...

I just can't see an entry to understanding the js AI, but I've been playing with the available legacy AIs to see if I could get them (the Xpats and Boyracers) to do what they used to. I was about to give up thinking they were fully deprecated when there was a breakthrough, and the legacy AIs still manage to convey personality and prompt the messages as they should.

My own old primitive boyracerAI.plist I'm leaving as is for now since it's.. insane, like foul mouthed youth on berserker drugs. When they see me in the aegis they insult me, attack me, cops come to my aid but the little devils are so quick it takes a law platoon (with a turret unit) 5 minutes to gun them down. Until then, they come close to death, squeal an apology, regenerate a bit and then return with insults and attack with no sense of self-preservation. Maybe this is as it should be?

[montana05]

Phkb's GalCop Missions features much new equipment including:

Patient Transport Module
Mass Passenger Transport Module

It's worth noting that both those items are related to specific missions, and aren't really usable for anything else. Once the mission is completed (success or failure), the equipment items are removed.

I certainly like the concept of it, it could be used in various OXP's, medical or SAR ships would come to my mind first.

[Cholmondely]

Phkb's GalCop Missions features much new equipment including:

Patient Transport Module
Mass Passenger Transport Module

It's worth noting that both those items are related to specific missions, and aren't really usable for anything else. Once the mission is completed (success or failure), the equipment items are removed.

I certainly like the concept of it, it could be used in various OXP's, medical or SAR ships would come to my mind first.

Full list of Equipment coming with Phkb's GalCop Missions OXP:
printed in light blue as this will be a game spoiler for some...
Recovered Black Box 1500 1+
Cargo Stopper 300 6+
Comms Relay Beacon Switch 600 3+
Comms Relay Beacon Switch Recharge 200 1+
Ejection Damper 1000 7+
Escape Pod 10000 1+
Medical Supplies 1 1+
Mass Passenger Transport Module 1 1+
Patient Transport Module 1 1+
Range Finder Extender 26500 9+
Range Finder MFD 2500 5+
Recovered cargopod 20000 1+
Seismic Resonance Scanner 150000 1+
GalCop Station Security Software 250000 1+
Solar Radiation Disrupter Missile 2500 1+
Solar Activity Scanner 150000 1+
Station Killer Missile 125300 15+
Recovered High-Level Security Codes 130000 1+
Recovered Classified Documents 130000 1+
Recovered Prototype Ship Schematics 130000 1+
Recovered Military Weapons Designs 130000 1+
Unprocessed Scan Data 2000 1+
Virus Specimens 1 1+
Witchpoint Beacon Security Access 1 1+

[Cholmondely]

Speaking of Griff, I keep trying to use his Adder to make the prohip Xpat, but when assembling the little pieces of ship surface he cuts out and meticulously orders on his textures, I reach a point where I scream out loud and realise I will never have the skill or temperament to handle such intricate detail work. In a violent reaction I reach for what I know, the broad crude brush of dark ugly metal, and try to make the best of it.



With this kind of junkyard job, it feels somewhat appropriate. None of those handsome little panels though.

... It's solo-packaged and supposedly in working order, if you want to give it a closer look, PROHIP Xpat b1 1024 (4.9 MB)

Just thinking: would it make sense to list your Iron Ass Vol 4 as a "Conflict OXP'' in the manifest.plist for this newer prohip version?

This would prevent this new version being loaded if Iron Ass Vol 4 with the Iron Ass Refugee Adder was present. I am presuming that if one has Iron Ass Vol 4 loaded, that one also has the rest of your suite loaded and that this newer Refugee Adder is one to remove from the oxp cocktail.

[Old Murgh]

Just thinking: would it make sense to list your Iron Ass Vol 4 as a "Conflict OXP'' in the manifest.plist for this newer prohip version?

This would prevent this new version being loaded if Iron Ass Vol 4 with the Iron Ass Refugee Adder was present. I am presuming that if one has Iron Ass Vol 4 loaded, that one also has the rest of your suite loaded and that this newer Refugee Adder is one to remove from the oxp cocktail.

I don’t think so. As is, both draw from the systemspawn pool of the trader role (both at 25% of a slot), they shouldn’t conflict, and the prohip won’t spawn an ironass as a companion. All internal names are different so there shouln’t be any relation. If I missed something I should be able to fix it.

Not that I see many players combining these two styles..

[Cholmondely]

Some of the things I want to do with the Xpat are a bit codependent on the results of the scripting that Montana is helping me out with on the RustyAss project, appearance conditions and such.

It should be within my capacity to give them their customary broadcast, and have sparks coming out of the ships, but the actual shredding from metal fatigue (and no external cause) I don't see happening. I think the odds of ever witnessing this tiny moment are too small to be worth the effort (though I suppose if one stalked them into a witch-hole and kept eyes on them constantly it isn't too far-fetched, but who would do that?)

..but finding an Xpat post-shredding, –both in witchspace and normalspace– is something I had in mind. I figure this would leave a small school of inert slave-capsules near the wreckage.

So, just musing about this even more...

1) I wonder if there might be something inside CustomShields which would be useful (this oxp contains hundreds of ship damage effects - mostly to do with shields in combat, but some for losing hull plates, fuel leaks, etc.

2) If there are still problems escorting the Refugees to the station, perhaps one could steal relevant code from one of the following:
*Escort Contracts OXP Capt Murphy et al. (2011-15)
*Rescue Stations escort missions
*Oo-Haul escort missions

3) How does one get food/medicine/water/machinery etc over to the refugee adder?
* they do it themselves - and send somebody over in a spacesuit to pick up the goodies.
* you do it yourself - use Astronaut and haul the goodies over to them...
* maybe there would be some sort of bot/drone which could do the job - there might be one which might be part of the CobraMk3 equipment which might be modifiable for the job:

5. Run system checks and perform onboard repairs and tune-ups

Of the above, I think 3 and 4 have potential and I like the sound of #6 as it could be strategic. 5 could be... well, I'm really not sure about that one being fun.

5. Run system checks and perform onboard repairs and tune-ups
It would depend on how it's done. They would need to be gamified somewhat - essentially, take some minor timewaster games like Minesweeper, Hunt the Wumpus, Freecell, Pipe Mania etc. and repurpose them (simplifying/streamlining where necessary) into "purging the energy grid", "isolating a damaged interlink", "smoothing the plasma flow", "improving energy distribution", and so on. The advantage in doing these things would be to delay the next maintenance overhaul a bit - possibly important on a long, time-critical journey, but not compulsory by any means.

You might ask, why not just play a timewaster game? I would argue that - given an in-game purpose and context - these wouldn't feel like timewasters. There's lots of precedence for this sort of thing - a variant of Pipe Mania is used to simulate hacking in BioShock, for example.

Edited to show flow of ideas.

It might be able to devise a Disembodied-style exercise for transmogrifying the complementary rivet-inspection drone which came with my cobra to allow it to haul a TC laden with water over to the refugee adder...

Griff Robotic Cargo Loader - possibly from Griff's Busy Ports

[Cholmondely]

Pilots should have options.

Escorting the adder should be one of them, perhaps use code from  Escort Contracts OXP ?


The astronaut stuff seems to require green status and possibly need a switch to EVA mode .

Depending on SW economy for the goods feels to restrictive .

How about a new missile-like item , Rescue Pod ?
Instead of explosives its payload would be remlock masks, water canteens and such .
It would be fired and targeted like a missile.

Sorry, Lone Wolf, moved the discussion here to try and keep it in a relevant thread.


I agree with you about pilot options. More options would also be nice, but I've enough difficulty coping with the options I thought of!



I had a trawl through all of our OXPs and could find nothing which seemed to work. Most OXPs seem to involve you following a trader, while the others seem to involve escort fighters following you.

I feel that something different is needed here.



1) I want to persuade a cowardly  Refugee Adder to follow me - that I will protect him. He has no way of knowing that I won't just capture him and sell all his refugees as slaves. How can I persuade him?

Ideally I could give him something as a present - fuel, food, et cetera. But how to game it? (Did you try out  Astronaut?)

He has no scoops (Actually some of them might - it would make sense in terms of refuelling in Stranger's World, less so if sunskimming - would that then be fatal in a RAdder without heat shielding? It's not in a 0.35LM Cobra Mk.3. RAdder Speed is 0.175LM - a Python is 0.2LM: https://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/Slowe ... s_(Oolite))



2) For example, where the Refugee Adder follows you until a fight develops. At which stage you can fight off the McNasties, giving the RAdder a chance to flee for safety. It would be nice to be able to tell it where to safely flee to, but that would be too complex, I fear.

So a rough outline of possible interactions might be this:

One possibility:
- general conversation (already in OXP) to make acquaintance
- give RAdder something as above.
- offer to escort RAdder to main orbital station (this might involve persuading the GalCops to let him dock, or the station to let him dock)
- do it!

Alternative:
- meet RAdder under attack. Come to his help. (Is there still now a need to win his confidence?)
- offer to escort RAdder to main orbital station as above



Appendices:

This is DGill's script (altered from his Feudal States OXP suite):

Code: Select all

"use strict";
/*

feudalAItest.js

Script for creating and handling Feudal Carriers.


Oolite
Copyright © 2003-2012 Giles C Williams and contributors

This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License
as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2
of the License, or (at your option) any later version.

This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
GNU General Public License for more details.

You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software
Foundation, Inc., 51 Franklin Street, Fifth Floor, Boston,
MA 02110-1301, USA.


thargoid_carrier.oxp
Copyright © 2006-2012 "Selezen", scripting by "Commander McLane"

This work is licensed under the Creative Commons
Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 3.0 Unported License.

To view a copy of this license, visit
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/ or send a letter
to Creative Commons, 171 Second Street, Suite 300, San Francisco,
California, 94105, USA.

*/

this.name           = "feudalAItest";
this.description    = "Script for testing an AI";
this.author         = "DG";
this.copyright      = "© 2012 Selezen and Commander McLane";
this.license        = "CC-by-nc-sa 3.0";
this.version        = "1.0";

this.startUp = function () {

}


this.broadcastcontrol = function() {
 

var w = worldScripts.BroadcastCommsMFD;
w.$createMessage({
messageName:this.name + "myMessage1",
callbackFunction:this.$broadcastCallback.bind(this),
displayText:"Follow",
messageText:"Follow me, old boy!",
transmissionType:"broadcast",
deleteOnTransmit:false,
delayCallback:4});

  w.$createMessage({
   messageName:this.name + "myMessage2", 
   callbackFunction:this.$broadcastCallback1.bind(this), 
   displayText:"Dock with Station", 
   messageText:"Please dock with the Main Orbital Station.", 
   transmissionType:"broadcast", 
   deleteOnTransmit:false, 
   delayCallback:2});   
   
}   
   	 
this.$broadcastCallback = function () {
	 
this.ship = player.ship.target;
this.ship.switchAI("BCCregroupAI.plist");
	
};

  this.$broadcastCallback1 = function (){
	 
this.ship = player.ship.target;
this.ship.switchAI("BCCdockAI.plist");
	
};


this.shipWillLaunchFromStation = function() {
this.broadcastcontrol();
}

this.shipLaunchedFromStation = function()
{
	
		if(system.countShipsWithRole("feudal-LanceTest") == 0) {
		system.addShipsToRoute("feudal-LanceTest", 1, 0.90);
		}
		player.commsMessage("press Shift N to activate Broadcast Comm - press ; to view multi-function display - Target ship - press B to select required command - press N to issue command.");
	
}

this.locatePlayer = function() {
	this.playerArray = system.shipsWithPrimaryRole("player");
	if(this.playerArray.length > 0)
		{
		this.ship.target = this.playerArray[0];
		this.ship.reactToAIMessage("PLAYER_FOUND");
		}
}

this.checkPlayerDistance = function() {
	if(!player.ship)
		{
		return;	
		}

	this.playerDistance = this.ship.position.distanceTo(player.ship.position);
	if(this.playerDistance > 51200) // if the escort is more than 2 scanner ranges from the player, move it just off-scanner
		{
		let playerDirection = player.ship.position.subtract(this.ship.position).direction(); 
		let newPosition = player.ship.position.subtract(playerDirection.multiply(30000));
		if (oolite.compareVersion('1.73') <= 0) 
			{
			this.ship.position = newPosition;
			}
		else 
			{
			this.ship.setPosition(newPosition);
			}
		this.ship.reactToAIMessage("PLAYER_MID");
		return;
		}

	if(this.playerDistance < 25600)
		{
		this.ship.reactToAIMessage("PLAYER_NEAR");
		}
	else
		{
		if(this.playerDistance > 38400 || player.ship.speed > 2000)
			{
			this.ship.reactToAIMessage("PLAYER_FAR");
			}
		else
			{
			this.ship.reactToAIMessage("PLAYER_MID");
			}
		}
}

I need to move it over into the RAdder OXP (which already has an AI) - and do the work on BCC too.

Lots of fun for a non-programmer!



Sunskimming (from https://wiki.alioth.net/index.php/Fuel_ ... oping_Fuel)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITefPraygXM - YouTube Film by Smivs
Note the external glow as the ship heats up! Smivs's Python is slower than Phkb's player Cobra Mk.3 (0.20lm versus 0.35lm), and he uses his injectors once he starts to refuel. Does he have heat shielding too?

I feel strongly that the Refugee Adder would go the way of all Trumbles if he tried it. Even if you argue that he would have heat shielding (Adders are designed to land on planet surfaces and in PlanetFall1 one needed heat shielding to land. But not PF2, if I understand properly.