Rough Guide to the Ooniverse

General discussion for players of Oolite.

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Lestradae
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Post by Lestradae »

Apparently, I am the only one who found this post to be so absurdly hypocritical that I literally Laughed Out Loud. ... I've come to expect the blunt responses ... I do take issue with the way the board, as represented by the posters in this thread, treated a fellow member wishing to contribute to the community. I'm sure the criticism was meant to be constructive, but it sounded both dismissive and more than a little rude to me.
No, you`re not the only one who sees it like that. I have also noticed this and taken offense once or twice myself. It seems to be the curse of the internet that people have a tendency to write things into this basically anonymous place they would not easily dare say into someone`s face.

I think that should change. It drives people away. That has already happened in the past and I was thinking about it at one point myself.

If someone contributes something, that should be encouraged, as it makes the game and the community more interesting. Not everyone can be an excellent scripter or writer or whatelse, but critisism can also be formulated in a constructive way and tone.

Perhaps one of the problems involved is that the admins that are named for the boards are no longer around (with the exception of Ahruman, who by the way also seems to have disappeared since three weeks ago)?
We have a great community here, and I hope in the future we will be considerate enough to kindly help a fellow member or at least thank him or her for their attempted contribution before tearing into the work they did for our community.
That is exactly as it should be. The OXPs are a great way that everyone can have in their game whatever they like and whatever they don`t like. Oolite is a community project, it doesn`t belong to some "special" people or even a group of people.

Please, no one understand this as a rant. I really think this is a problem that will reduce the resources Oolite has and the amount of interest it generates. This can not be in the best interest of anyone who invests some of their time and energy into this game.

Say your opinions and critisisms by all means, but please, do it in a constructive way.

My 2Cr

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Post by Cmdr. Maegil »

I do take issue with the way the board, as represented by the posters in this thread, treated a fellow member wishing to contribute to the community. I'm sure the criticism was meant to be constructive, but it sounded both dismissive and more than a little rude to me.
No, you`re not the only one who sees it like that. I have also noticed this and taken offense once or twice myself.
Hear, hear. I have already several posts on this thread about this matter alone.
Perhaps one of the problems involved is that the admins that are named for the boards are no longer around (with the exception of Ahruman, who by the way also seems to have disappeared since three weeks ago)?
We have a great community here, and I hope in the future we will be considerate enough to kindly help a fellow member or at least thank him or her for their attempted contribution before tearing into the work they did for our community.
Lack of admins has never been a problem in this board, and I believe that in the site's history only one person (spammers not included) was banned - and IMO for the wrong reasons. In fact, I agree this really is the friendliest forum I came across on the internet, and that's why I dubbed it TFBTSOR(TM).

I hope it remains that way...
Please, no one understand this as a rant. I really think this is a problem that will reduce the resources Oolite has and the amount of interest it generates. This is not in the interest of anyone who invests some of their time and energy into this game.
It's not even for the resources, but for the very spirit of cooperation and the fun of it all - we all get enough pressure from RL, and this boards have so far been a refreshing sanctum of civility and friendliness, a digital equivalent to a real bohemian hangout... They are so few they should be protected, but how to do so without killing their own nature?
You know those who, having been mugged and stabbed, fired, dog run over, house burned down, wife eloped with best friend, daughters becoming prostitutes and their countries invaded - still say that "all is well"?
I'm obviously not one of them.
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Post by TGHC »

Here Here! to all the above comments. This is the friendliest board around and occasionally some comments made are a little over critical, but that is just some peoples style, they often don't even realise it themselves. Beyond all that, all the people who frequent this board have a common desire to enhance this great game, so my advice to anyone who feels sensitised in any way is to rise above it and continue to work together.
The Grey Haired Commander has spoken!
OK so I'm a PC user - "you know whats scary? Out of billions of sperm I was the fastest"
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Post by Commander McLane »

@ FSOneblin: Sorry if we have hurt you. It wasn't meant so.

I guess each of us has his/her understanding what the Rough Guide is all about. I have tried to explain my understanding in my post above. I think it is valid and makes sense, but I don't expect everybody to agree with it. I feel, however, that Disembodied, who is the editor of the Rough Guide, does see it in a similar way. So I think I have a similar idea to his, about what kind of material should go into the Rough Guide.

The material that you suggested in your post is fine, and it is surely useful to have. I'm not saying "it has nothing to do with Oolite". It is just, in my opinion (which is an opinion, not a decree of God; which I hopefully have made clear enough by now), not the kind of material we are looking for for the Rough Guide. It is just a different kind of material. You are still completely free to "put it up", so there is no need to "take it down", but it should be put up just somewhere else. It even has already been put up - on the OXP-page of the wiki. So somebody else has already done this work for you.

That's all I'm saying.
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Post by Rxke »

(moderator here...)

I'm still around, and read most threads, and I noticed the rather curtish replies to FSOneblin's work, and for sure, it did make me frown. I thought you guys would've stepped up yourself to say, hey, hey, take it easy. :(

I moderate on another board, and there we have a policy of almost extreme hands-off moderating behaviour, only acting when things get way out of hand. I guess I got too used to that.

But you're right, Oolite bb *is* the friendliest board this side of Riedquat, so maybe I should've intervened with a friendly 'tsk,tsk,tsk,'... :oops:


So belatedly: people, try to stay constructive in your critiques. Remember you're writing on a board and what you type can sometimes sound overly critical, because there's no such thing as body language, eye-contact, instant feedback. This can lead to misunderstandings and hurt feelings. We don't want that, mmkay? :)
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Post by Selezen »

Sorry if my comments have been taken as overly critical, but I did include a caveat at the bottom of my post as kind of an apology for any offence taken. I do tend to assume that the majority of people are mature enough to take criticism on the chin. I'm an honest kind of guy, and I don't type anything here that I wouldn't say to anyone's face. I thought my comments were constructive on the whole, albeit prefaced with the word "sucks", and I didn't hint anywhere that FSO shouldn't continue with his efforts - they are as appreciated as anyone else's contributions, but I do tend to think that if a piece of work is going to be done then it should be done in a professional manner. If a person fully admits that he/she can't write or spell or anything, then writing up a document and posting it straight to a live area is maybe not the wisest thing to do. At the very least it should be proofread by someone first (and yes, I would be very willing to do the proofreading!).

oh, matt634, my comments were aimed at the production of content that is intended to be used as 'documentation' on, for example, the wiki - a spelling error on a forum isn't really the same thing.

If I have caused undue bad feeling, then I offer my heartfelt apologies to all, especially young FSOneblin, but I do stand by my comments.

:oops:

<waits to be beaten with the mod stick>
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Post by matt634 »

I moderate on another board, and there we have a policy of almost extreme hands-off moderating behaviour, only acting when things get way out of hand. I guess I got too used to that . . . maybe I should've intervened
@ Rxke - I agree with letting the community work things out for itself and only stepping in when necessary. I don't think things had gotten out of hand and don't think you neglected your duty.

@ Selezen - In the spirit of community harmony, I'm not going to start an argument about proofreading, context, and criticism. Further, I'll let go the condescending way in which you addressed me. I will, however, say this: backhanded apologies like "I'm sorry you're so immature\sensitive that I have to apologize" are not apologies at all and are better left unsaid.
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Post by Cmdr. Maegil »

Thank you all. Even the air seems lighter!... hehe...hehehaha...OK, who's the joker that HAHAHAHAHA... released nitrous oxide on the life support??!
You know those who, having been mugged and stabbed, fired, dog run over, house burned down, wife eloped with best friend, daughters becoming prostitutes and their countries invaded - still say that "all is well"?
I'm obviously not one of them.
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Post by FSOneblin »

Yeah, sorry that I took this poorly. This IS the friendliest internet community ever. Sorry about that. But is there any other way that I can help the community? I'm kind of inept, but, umm... Does reporting bug's count? I have lot's of spare time on my hand's, I will try to think something up.

Don't panic: FSOneblin.
Don't panic

Now an "adult!"
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Post by Ace Garp »

I think that reporting bugs will definitely be helpful - as long as you ensure that it has not already been reported!

That's about all that I currently do to help; as I'm still learning how to make OXPs - but that could take a while.

The only other thing I do is slight amendments to the WIKI, such as ship data and typos . . . :wink:

Bug reporting is still very important though - just play the game as much as you can (hard I know), and report anything that seems to be wrong.
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Post by LittleBear »

I did start adding descriptions of what each OXP does to the Wiki OXP page. Most have a short description but theres loads that don't have a descriptive page and lots of ships are just stub descriptions. Sort of meant to get back to it one day, but RL is pretty busy. Be handy if peeps un-stubbed a lot of the Wiki stuff. Hint. :wink:
OXPS : The Assassins Guild, Asteroid Storm, The Bank of the Black Monks, Random Hits, The Galactic Almanac, Renegade Pirates can be downloaded from the Elite Wiki here.
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Post by Cmdr. Maegil »

FSOneblin wrote:
Sorry about that. But is there any other way that I can help the community? I'm kind of inept, but, umm...
Cmdr. Maegil wrote:
I'm also not a native speaker, and used to make a LOT of mistakes while typing... Then I threw it on the spelling aid (one item at a time, so I can either learn the proper spelling or discard silly changes), proof read, rephrased, checked the thesaurus for synonyms, spell-checked again and finally posted!
Bug Reporting is good, also learning the minimum to understand the gist of some techno-babble OXP threads. Do keep posting, and do update the wiki even if with typos and crude grammar...

Of course, editing before posting is always nice, but it's better to have a page made with good will but poor technique than none at all!
You know those who, having been mugged and stabbed, fired, dog run over, house burned down, wife eloped with best friend, daughters becoming prostitutes and their countries invaded - still say that "all is well"?
I'm obviously not one of them.
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Post by FSOneblin »

Cmdr. Maegil wrote:
FSOneblin wrote:
Sorry about that. But is there any other way that I can help the community? I'm kind of inept, but, umm...
Cmdr. Maegil wrote:
I'm also not a native speaker, and used to make a LOT of mistakes while typing... Then I threw it on the spelling aid (one item at a time, so I can either learn the proper spelling or discard silly changes), proof read, rephrased, checked the thesaurus for synonyms, spell-checked again and finally posted!
Bug Reporting is good, also learning the minimum to understand the gist of some techno-babble OXP threads. Do keep posting, and do update the wiki even if with typos and crude grammar...

Of course, editing before posting is always nice, but it's better to have a page made with good will but poor technique than none at all!

Ok then. I will try oxping, And try to update the wiki. My I know someone who works for my towns news paper, I will ask him to check this over for me. Thanks!
Don't panic

Now an "adult!"
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Post by Disembodied »

@ FSOneblin: you can always indulge in the joys of (creative!) criticism too... :wink:

Here's a draft of a planetary description of Lave, for people to kick around:
Lave
Economic status: Rich Agricultural
Technology Level: 5
Population: 2.5 billion Human colonials
Political status: Dictatorship
Radius: 4116 km
G: 0.38 standard
“Lave is most famous for its vast rain forests and the Laveian tree grub.”
What can we say about Lave? Everyone knows Lave. We all trained there. The outlines of her continents are burned into our brains, from endless hours above them doing our jumps-and-bumps. Close your eyes and you’ll see them still: the arc of Crater Bay; the juts and jags of the Fenric coast; the curling comma Suther makes, creeping over the horizon into the short Laveian night. Many of us dropped down the well to Port Arcadia, and spent too much money, and might still have the faded Et In Arcadia Ego t-shirts to show for it. Been, seen, done: now we’re up and out and we’re never going back.

Which is a shame, because Lave is an interesting world, socially, politically, and historically. Port Arcadia can be ghastly, it’s true: heaving with trainees, blundering around on ups and downs from howffs and whorehouses, sinks and stews, singing, shouting, fighting and fornicating as inclination and anatomy take them. We were never like that, oh no; we were merry, true; high-spirited, and perhaps even a little rowdy from time to time, but...

Leave them to it, is my advice, and put PA behind you. There’s a lot more to Lave than flight training and juvenile debauchery.

For a start, it’s one of the oldest human settlements in the eight sectors, colonised way back in the twenty-third century. Ashoria, the planetary capital, positively reeks of history. The central seat of government, the Hermione, sits within the bays of the original colony ship. Although it’s crusted over now with offices and extensions, chambers and bureaucratoria, the Tyrant still rules from the Bridge and the formal gardens still lead you to the main gangway. For any student of the history of human spaceflight, a tour around the Hermione is a fascinating voyage back in time. Trips should be booked well in advance, although it is sometimes possible to pick up a standby ticket if you get there early enough. The adjacent Museum of the First provides an enjoyable, though less immediate, introduction to the early colonial days. It’s free, too.

Inevitably, these official histories have been sanitised, and have little to say about the darker episodes of Lave’s past. The worst incident, when Idrian Ageddor of the Ten destroyed the Revanchist bastion with an asteroid, is of course mentioned – although Laveians today refer to it as “the Calamity”, and make a subtle hint that Ageddor’s crime was accidental. The truth lies buried in the regolith, and no-one is keen to disturb it.

To keep both eyes on the past, though, is to walk blindly into the future, and it is to the Laveians’ credit that Ageddor’s atrocity brought defeat for the Revanchists and for the Ten. Appalled by the destruction, the armies and citizens of both factions rebelled, executed their leaders and instituted the governmental system which, with minor modifications, Lave enjoys today. The Empress looks down from her palace on Basta, the swift-running moon, ruling all, and interfering with no-one. Her loyal Tyrant presides over the self-electing Assembly, an easygoing, casual government which is content to devolve most decisions to the individual town Clatches scattered across the planet. Officially, Lave is a Dictatorship; officially, the Empress rules all; officially, in her absence, the Tyrant wields her power without check. But the Revanchist war taught everyone a lesson: “officially” is a thing of paper, and paper burns so easily.

Other, later tragedies are those all-too-common sins of humanity: ecological and environmental destruction. Most of Lave’s dense jungle has been cruelly decimated, with vast stretches given over to monocultures of cash crops. In recent years however some attempts have been made to protect the remainder, and plans for reforestation are the constant talk of Clatch and Assembly alike. Promising results are reported from the Daphne Project, a conservation and breeding programme for the Laveian tree-grub.

This mighty and iconic beast, pushed to the brink of extinction, is being re-introduced into the wild, in a joint effort between the human majority and the felinoid (strictly, leonid) settlement on the island continent of Suther. A protected grove of thirty sessile adult females produce up to three tons of juvenile grubs each year through artificial insemination: most are sold off-world to grace the tables of exclusive restaurants across the galaxy, which helps fund the project, but a small percentage are hand-reared to the third instar and released into specially controlled zones of Suther’s forests. There they hunt, and grow to full adulthood. The females smash down a clearing for themselves, and take root, their barrel trunks eventually topping out the jungle canopy. The males, black and dun and mottled green, armoured in great bark-like scales, stake out their territories centred on these wife-trees. The rotting carcasses of their many kills – aushers, engelots and even sometimes paraderms – enrich the soil, and bring the wife-trees to fruitfulness. Then roaring copulations shake the forest to its foundations, and soon a new generation writhes out of the mother branches to begin the cycle anew. Small tourist parties now have the chance to see, from the safety of a flitter, these fearsome predators in their natural state.

The Daphne Project gives some hope for Lave’s ecological future, and its success points out another aspect of the planet’s culture: the easy relationship which persists there between a multiplicity of races. “Wouldn’t rate a second look on Lave” is an expression we all know! Port Arcadia, of course, is perhaps the most cosmopolitan city anywhere across the eight, but go anywhere on Lave and you’ll see a staggering variety of anatomies, physiognomies, pelts and pigmentations. Almost everywhere provides a bewildering range of facilities and necessities, and if they can’t immediately cater to your needs most Laveians will make it a point of pride to accommodate you eventually. Lave may not be the richest, or the most advanced, or the most efficiently governed planet in the galaxy, but in this respect alone it justifies its status as the headquarters of the Co-operative, and this is why, officially – that word again – the Co-op Fleet owes allegiance to Lave’s moon-bound Empress. It may be foolish, it may be sentimental, but I am one veteran proud to have served in Her Imperial Majesty’s Space Navy.
Edit: I should have said, several elements are derived from Selezen's Lave page on the wiki.
2nd edit: changing name of planetary capital to Ashoria.
Last edited by Disembodied on Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Commander McLane »

Again, ingenious!!! :D :D :D :D :D

This is going to be a must-have compendium for any Elite/Oolite-addict! :D :D :D :D :D
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